[quote=“MTzadok, post:40, topic:655,full:true”]
You choosing to take, freely and without outside coercion makes it not murder.[/quote]
That depends on the circumstances and jurisdiction
If you assist someone in committing suicide that may be considered homicide
In circumstances where a suicidee can not physically self administer poison, the assistant is not being violent dispite technically murdering them
It’s not black and white for sure
Not IMO. Now you are talking consent?
NVM, I read further.
Isn’t “Manslaughter” a better term?
I mean that murder implies willing to kill, even planning it.
Excuse me but sometimes details get lost in translation, despite of my effort to apprehend them.
I will also highlight that, poisoning someone is murder. I will even say that poisoning someone to death, even in the subtle case of Arsenic and Old Lace, is violent.
Force is force. Violence can be subtle and soft and still be violent.
You put someone in a fridge, shower him slowly with running colder water…
*Edit DON’T TRY 
THIS AT HOME
I don’t agree that this example constitutes violence
Perhaps if you froze the water into a lump and dropped it on their head?..
You said lethal injection “requires no force”.
Do you want that in Newtons, dynes? What.
How much force in a loving caress in Newtons pls tnx
Hypothermia is terrifying.
Death is terrifying.
Inducing, provoking or causing death is violent per se.
Guillotine was invented to make it less violent. And so lethal injection.
It all fails because readiness to death does not exist. You can repress the expression of the emotional struggle of facing death, through drugs or even training.
But inside there is a little baby crying for mama. A little baboon squealing for the fear to fade away. Half of a stomped cockroach fighting his way out of the shoe.
There is not such a non violent execution.
But my idea was to discuss about the moral right to do so by States or Countries, if they don’t grant you an environment of security, freedom, prosperity and opportunities.
I agree that death is terrifying, but that does not imply violence
If a person is agoraphobic does that make open spaces violent ?
I could continue to cite examples of non violent death causing if you want
I would argue that the States that are more likely to guarantee the security, freedom, prosperity and opportunity for it’s citizens are less likely to sanction judicial homicide
Why are those things prerequisites?
homicide does not require violence. It is not part of the definition.
It requires intent or mens rhea; you have to know what your doing will lead to another deaths.
Thanks, that’s a very useful concept.
I was highlighting something I am starting to look at as a paradox
Why Norway wouldn’t kill a mass murderer and even heal him from a cancer?, while other lesser protective countries would do so even with charges not as flagrant.
Precisely. Why? 
That’s a good question
Perhaps cross reference a list of countries with a good record of social justice with judicial homicide rates to see if the most ‘humane’ have cultural similarities?
If you wanted to clarify your position to state that some governments wish to have a monopoly on homicide, then I would agree.
I’m not sure I see a paradox anywhere in what your arguments. There is an issue of responsibility though because if the state kills someone then those, the people the government represents, also share in the culpability for the homicide. That is why most developed democratic states have abolished the practice.
Great. I understand that as a solid argument against death penalty in a retentionist country, (a historically utilized one, if I can vaguely recall well).
In a fast look at a fancy map in Wikipedia I noticed that Russia has been classified as “abolitionist in fact”, something that surprises me.
Also one can see that Middle East is all red coloured, something that suggests me to ask about social justice being a… post-Christianity concept (?).
Because I can remember a military friend telling me that in the Arab world, charity, in and through extensive family structures, has a strong role in the cultural “social-justice” Muslim concept (my excuses to maronites). And they even “enjoy of” public executions in fancy ways.
You mean murder/manslaughter, etc.
Homicide is just a dead human caused by another human.
Homicide can be accidental.
Yes, I stand corrected, my bad
