It was an interesting viewpoint fairly early on in the pandemic.
Yeah i’m not convinced, i’ll be honest. Certain high risk age groups and co-morbidities, sure. Your average sub 60 healthy individual, not so much (I also think this changes based on strain being discussed).
Yeah, as soon as you have exposure without re-infection.
I used to argue with the anti-vaxxer crowd. I have less faith in the system now because of how it turned into a religion and how in bed everyone is with the pharmaceutical companies. “Trust the science”, “we moved at the speed of science”, “safe and effective”, “smarter people than you have thought about this”, “leave science to the scientists” … yeah fuck that. Science isn’t about trust, and since when is it a bad thing to think for yourself.
Why would you trust a pharmaceutical company more than an insurance company, a bank, a telco, fuck knows, it’s a business and they all have a history of unethical behavior, same thing you’d find in any highly competitive, cut-throat market. People are too naive.
So now i have no tribe, worship at the alter of modern medicine, or claim polio was never a thing. It’s a shitty situation.
Im always arguing with anti vaxxers as they are generally ignorant .
Some vaccine skeptics however can be reasoned with and are worth talking too.
Vaccine hardliners are also not worth arguing with as they can also be just as ignorant as the anti vaxxers.
There are reasons to be sceptical of large companies in general on occasion and pharmaceutical companies are no exception.
I can say this as a triple MRNA vaccinated person who believes that the MRNA vaccines were certainly a net positive and that’s before we consider how much residual benefit we get from all the data and knowledge of MRNA we know have for healthcare moving forward.
I also believe Pfizer has done amazingly well and produced many brilliant treatments (cough boner pills cough ) and will continue to do so but to pretend that they have not given anyone reason to be question them on occasion is ignorant.
This is ass too. You’re claiming that millions of people under 60 didn’t die or get lifelong illness from COVID.
Sorry, COVID killed thousands of doctors under the age of 60.
You’re relying on statistics to inform your viewpoint, which as we know, lie.
Sure it is about trust, which is why you believe (I hope) that the Earth is a spheroid, and not flat. Because you’re promoting the same slippery slope logic that Flat Earthers use all the time.
Because pharmaceutical companies are regulated, and nothing they produce in this day and age is available to the public without a shitload of due diligence.
Nigeria sued Pfizer, huh? I can tell you horror stories of what happened to people who actually went there to collect their 419 money.
That lawsuit was dismissed in court, bruh.
Again, Louis Pasteur is eyerolling at you from the great beyond.
Please, stop capitalizing the m. It’s mRNA, not MRNA.
You know who else Loves to Capitalize Things? Donald Trump.
Here’s the dilemma: you’re not qualified to question mRNA vaccine technology. Neither is Burt. Neither of you are medical scientists. You are basically as qualified as Jenny McCarthy, pushing the same “do yer own reserch” crap.
Now, as a bona fide doctor of science and information assurance expert, I’m only partially qualified because I will actually take the time to READ and cross-examine these things.
I swear to god, in 2020-2021 we had debates here about COVID and I was so busy trying to convince people it was going to be deadly for millions, I heard the same “Big Pharma LIES” and “doctors just want your tax dollars” bullshit.
You want to lecture me on ignorant? I’ve spent my whole life trying to unignoraize people, and failing because they love Youtube and TikTok videos more than, you know, studying.
I’ve studied glass at the nanometer level. That’s 10 to the -9th. Billionths of a meter. Have you been to that level?
Pick a new subject. Full contact, silicon, business operations. Anything but medicine, vaccines, and other lifesaving sciences. Just stay out of it.
Remember the time you posted the pro RFK Jr, transphobic meme about Admiral Levine and claimed he was the healhier choice? She’s a fucking pediatrician and a 4 star flag office, and he’s a fucking lunatic who promoted Geert Vanden Bossche, who should have read more and posted less.
Yup, the old statistics debate, i use numbers to understand impact at scale. Also how we identify patterns.
Nope, supporting the actual scientific method which doesn’t encourage any of those things, doesn’t make me a flat earther. I don’t need to trust the earth is round, i can go read and verify for myself.
They are all regulated. I’ve already posted examples where pharmaceutical companies buy patents on chronic medication and then hike prices by 400% because they have a captive market to site one instance. There are many cases, it’s stupid to assume they don’t function like any other company. They aren’t ethical hero’s saving the world, they are businesses that function like any other business.
The trouble with self taught people is they sometimes gravitate to books full of lies. Hell, I can direct you to some books on 19th century anthropology that would make you sick.
Much like RFK Jr is going to make people sick.
There are is quite a long heritage of ethical heroes in “big Pharma”. Your post modern viewpoint isn’t completely wrong but it’s a bit sour.
In fact, Pasteur himself is currently being demonized by religious nutjobs, because he was an.ethical hero.
I fear we now live in a age of such dark cynisicm, no one believes in heroes anymore.
There are some great books on how scientific knowledge has developed like “The Upright Thinkers - Leonard Mlodinow”. It describes how fields of scientist crosscheck each other, how it fits together and how our body of knowledge has developed. I don’t trust, answers we have are point in time, they remain true until someone disproves them or we have better answers. I trust that the scientific method produces the best answers at a point in time. You know … question, hypotheses, experimentation, etc. Then you share and other scientists recreate, check, test, verify, etc.
I think it’s good to pursue knowledge, you aren’t going to convince me that people shouldn’t read because books can be dangerous. The more views you read the better. The books of today that you follow might be the dangerous books a hundred years down the line. It’s all about perspective.
There are always good people in companies, doesn’t mean it’s run in an ethical way. I’d be more convinced if they shared the formula they were using with the scientific community. If you read many of the studies, especially early on (it hasn’t changed as far as i know but it’s been a while since i’ve looked) you will see scientist stating that they didn’t have the exact formula so they had to try and evaluate based on outcomes they were seeing. Basically black box testing without any access or source code. They also wouldn’t have gone to court to seal their testing data and stop it from being released for the next 50 years, or redacted the crap out of it once the courts forced them to release the data.
There is so much obviously wrong with the picture that people are intentionally not looking at.
It is easier for man to kill the light inside than conquer the dark all around.
We no longer value individualism, the first person to find truth (point in time) is wrong to everyone around them. It’s important not to just dismiss people because they don’t share the current world view.
Have concerns about the rollout? flat earther, anti vaxxer, ignorant. If we can’t challenge, we can’t develop, we can’t improve. There is no progress without questioning.
If you haven’t read “Brave new world” you really should. The discussion between the world controller and savage really gave insight into how people are happy not to think and want to be controlled.
“A really efficient totalitarian state would be one in which the all-powerful executive of political bosses and their army of managers control a population of slaves who do not have to be coerced, because they love their servitude.”
Science is not about trust, it is about objective thinking, challenge, scrutiny, questioning, testing, verification, etc.
What is truly frightening is the emotion fuelled fanaticism combined with their egos inability to allow them to accept any change to the already ingrained belief .
Those on the right have recently incorrectly labelled this as the “woke mind virus” but it has nothing to do with the belief adopted by the person as we see the same mental problem across the entire spectrum of religion, politics, and many other subjects often by people who are very intelligent but yet still have this weird attachment to not being perceived to be wrong or conceding ground or appreciating that others see things differently sometimes less their entire emotional world come crumbling down around them.
Personally I find that analysing ones own opinions and behaviour sometimes and admitting when you have made a mistake is quite liberating.
Mark Zuckerberg told Joe Rogan on a podcast that Biden’s White House said Meta had to take down posts saying Covid vaccines might have side effects.
Zuckerberg said he thought the Covid vaccines were more positive than negative, but that the administration was pushing to take down posts that were true.
Since Donald Trump’s victory in November, Zuckerberg has made a number of moves and announcements that appear targeted at appeasing the president-elect.
Not necessarily a new thing, but i think it’s gotten worse, feels like things have spiralled since 2020.
reminds me of: “A new scientific truth does not triumph by convincing its opponents and making them see the light, but rather because its opponents eventually die, and a new generation grows up that is familiar with it.”
Coronavirus masks: Boris Johnson signals U-turn over ‘useful’ face coverings
The government’s change of position would appear to reflect disagreement within Sage and among scientists generally.
Wearing face masks did not reduce risk of Covid infection after first Omicron wave, research shows
Boris Fucking Johnson? No wonder you like RFK Jr. BOF
Ask any fucking surgeon why he scrubs his body and wears a surgical mask before he opens up your fucking body with a knife.
Again, you’re not qualified to “ask questions”. That’s for other doctors to do.
Do you even know what a nanoparticle is? It’s similar to a bead of silicon at 10^-9th meter, about the size of a SARS-CoV-2 particle. But because those particles don’t travel in, say, the vacuum of outer fucking space, masks work to catch them.
Seriously, what’s the most advanced science course you’ve ever taken. Glass studies 101?
Science has always been about trust, because only 1 out of thousands actually understand it. If you want to test that claim, brush up on your transfinite calculus, bud. Because we can have that throwdown.
And you are witnessing, especially in this thread, how eroded trust in science has become. Largely by over thinkers like yourself, to quote Tool’s “Lateralus”. “Overthinking, overanalyzing, separates the body from the mind”.
Your lies,.and @PDA are a textbook example of misinformation masquerading as critical thinking. Why Mel Gibson and Joe Rogan get airtime for their nonmedical bullshit, why Libertarians like Ron Paul fucked up this country, and why people like me, an actual doctor of information assurance, along with the immunologist on the Bullshido board, gets trolled by nerds online, like Mark Zuckerberg, who dropped out of Harvard but became rich anyway.
Did you know Steve Jobs died because of you? He didn’t trust medical science either and it killed him, but created the cult of the device in your hand.
Because we both know you’re not an Android type. Those people actually trust the scientific method.
