Well, Keith, before I knew of Bullshido, I did google searches for instructors. A few of them came up here. That’s how I learned about this site.
Your arguement seems weak at best. That’s like saying a sex offender list is useless. It’s there, it’s a public service, more than enough people are aware of it, it does it’s job well.
Harboring Frauds. Tell me, is Morton banned here? Just curious.
Harboring Frauds. Y’all keep saying this. Can I have a list of names please?
[quote=Kaith Rustaz;2225816]Harboring Frauds. Tell me, is Morton banned here? Just curious.
[/quote]
No, because he was given the opportunity to defend himself in an open discussion.
MT on the other hand would ban all those who would question his credentials.
Your point fails.
A sex offender list IS useless, if one doesn’t a-know it exists and b-look at it. Those have been blocked btw on MT, based on police, court and news reports, and the names posted, and links to the appropriate lists and resources provided. And, the name is NOT KEITH. That’s an A not an E, and my name is Bob. Not Boob for the smart asses out there with key repeat syndrome.
Yet another problem is that you are only noticing the victims, not those who actually DID search. Check newbietown and you’ll find a few threads where people have asked about people or schools and the bullies followed up with a resounding “AVOID!”
It goes back to the old adage “Buyer beware!” Those who haven’t learned this proverb will end up burned. For those who have learned and live by this wisdom, Bullshido will always be there.
Martial Talk, however, harbors these frauds and liars as if they’re on equal ground. (Back to restaurants) Would you like a hole-in-the-wall podunk POS store that got a C from the Dept of Public Health being included in the Zagat survey simply because they’re another restaurant? Granted I’m pushing a bit much with that one, but the idea still stands: Frauds are not, and should not, be treated as equals with the real deals.
The point is that’s a lie and you know it’s a lie. People there slag off bullshido constantly. Hell, just in the Matt Morton thread we had your fraudbuster policy statement that is mostly a passive aggressive slam at BS, plus gems like “other forums out there that take pride in bashing people, as well as various arts” and “the Site That Shall Not Be Named.” One by an admin.
[quote=Kaith Rustaz;2225818]A sex offender list IS useless, if one doesn’t a-know it exists and b-look at it.
[/quote]
You are describing a retarded individual.
I always check a neighborhood map on their site before I move into a new neighborhood.
And, the name is NOT KEITH. That’s an A not an E, and my name is Bob.
Apologies, Bob. I assumed there was a typo.
[quote=Humanzee;2225817]No, because he was given the opportunity to defend himself in an open discussion.
MT on the other hand would ban all those who would question his credentials.
Your point fails.[/quote]
4.16.1 of our rules clearly state “MartialTalk and its staff encourage the polite and professional search for knowledge. Questions and concerns may be brought up, with the understanding that the other party is under no requirement to answer.”
We banned trolls seeking to shit stir.
So, now that he’s a convicted fraud, has Morton been banned from Bullshido? Because if he’s not banned here, then it’s hypocritical to think that any other site should ban him or anyone simply on your hearsay.
[quote=Kaith Rustaz;2225790]Yeah, probably. So would someone over there ripping on BS. Point?
487 investigations. Other than feeling good about yourselves, what has your actual effect on the martial arts industry been? Lets see some hard numbers here showing how you’ve helped clean things up. Or doesn’t that matter?[/quote]
One thing you have to keep in mind is Bullshido’s mission is to “expose” fraudulent claims. We don’t have the ability or authority to stop a person from starting up a business, demote them of rank, or put them in jail.
What we can do show the facts of an investigation for the consumer, or report to a governing body, and sometimes provide evidence of outright fraud and misconduct which in term has lead to a police investigation.
While the latter two are rarer, the most important thing we do is provide that summery of a investigation for all to see. Here is an example:
Go to Google
Type in “Coda Scott”
The first result you will see is the results of a BS.net investigation. Anyone wanting to take classes from Mr. Scott would do well to read that summery.
Your request on hard number would be impossible to find out since we can’t know how many people didn’t join after searching the web and we can’t possibly track down how many people left because of it.I do know of many people who have created an account just to thank BS.net for doing what we do and many members on this board whose perception on what effective martial arts is has been changed by what we do.
Thank you for your invitation, but I would much rather communicate with people who don’t have a policy that shelters frauds.
[quote=Humanzee;2225823]You are describing a retarded individual.
I always check a neighborhood map on their site before I move into a new neighborhood.[/quote]
I do too, but not everyone even knows they exist or how to access them. Same is true of crime stats, tax rates, etc.
Apologies, Bob. I assumed there was a typo.
No worries. Been a few folks who’ve done it.
[quote=Kaith Rustaz;2225816]Harboring Frauds. Tell me, is Morton banned here? Just curious.
Harboring Frauds. Y’all keep saying this. Can I have a list of names please?[/quote]
No, he isn’t. Hello everyone - No BS MMA and Martial Arts
Your very policy of no investigations on MT by nature is an environment for harboring frauds.
And in the real world, most people know that there is such thing as a sex offender list. In the real world if people are aware of a forum such as Bullshido or Partial Talk, then there is a good chance that they have basic knowledge in using a search engine. Unless I see you advertising your forum on print media, there’s a good chance it was reached by using a search engine. So your idea that putting information out there is practically useless is flawed.
In fact to use your reasoning, what’s the purpose of YOUR forum if it’s useless to get information out there? Circle-jerking, eh?
[quote=Kaith Rustaz;2225816]Harboring Frauds. Tell me, is Morton banned here? Just curious.
Harboring Frauds. Y’all keep saying this. Can I have a list of names please?[/quote]
Red Herring, Kaith.
First, very, very few people are banned from this site, most of them are teenage morons that can’t type to save their lives, the remaining 95% are spam bots and accounts.
Second, “harboring” isn’t something we do here. Here, there are no sacred cows, everyone and everything is open to questioning. Come on in and make claims, fine, but don’t get all pissed off when calls for proof or substantiation are made. If one is legitimate, then they have nothing to fear. As a corollary, people disagreeing with you or not respecting your background does != illegitimate credentials. Barring the very recent changes to your site’s policy, it used to read, and I’m paraphrasing: 1. we don’t check credentials and 2. we don’t bust frauds. THIS is harboring frauds, and what is known as “willful ignorance”. Closing one’s eyes and humming does not make the 500 gorilla under the bed go away. Then again, you guys wouldn’t know who the frauds and hucksters are, because your damn policy doesn’t allow people to look into things.
Finally, in terms of Matt Morton, you and your site are acting like petulant children with the whole “Has USJA posted it yet??”. We’ve already proven beyond any shadow of a doubt Morton is a fraud. He’s all but stated it here in our threads in his own words. The evidence is there, plain as day, yet still you are “waiting for official word from USJA” before being willing to admit he is a complete liar. I’m guessing the blurb in your new policy about “reporting frauds” doesn’t include successful Bullshido investigations as legit references, eh?
Edit- Slightly beaten by psychodad. :5hot:
Kaith please explain the blatant double standards on MT. I saw a few threads “outing” people and accusing them of fraud over there.
We don’t view this site as credible. Consumerwatch doesn’t invade Scambusters on a quarterly basis. I haven’t seen the guys from Consumerist trying to hack the FightBack forum. But, Bullshido likes their drama, likes to talk smack about everyone, and likes to not read what is in plain view. Our “Damn Policy” is out there in plain english. It fully supports inquiry. It doesn’t allow gang ups, brow beating and waterboarding. We also don’t ban people based on what another site says, a site that doesn’t ban that person but thinks we should based on their say so? I don’t think so. I’ll say it again, because it seems some can’t read. The Morton threads are still there, still public. So are a lot of others. Seriously, I sometimes think arguing here is like being in a Taliban court. You’re guilty no matter what. Sheesh.
“2) Your very policy of no investigations on MT by nature is an environment for harboring frauds.”
We allow investigations, relying on fact and professionalism. Not school yard antics.
I asked for a list of names of all the frauds we are supposedly harboring. If we are harboring them, you must have names.
Matthew Morton.
And yet you still keep on coming back here with the need to defend yourself. So what’s wrong? The urge to get the last word in that strong for you?
1 name isn’t a list. If we’re this big safe fraud harbor, surely there are dozens, hundreds that you can name. Or is it all hype and the usual BS from here?
Would you allow us to start questioning people’s credentials on your forum are you are going to throw your “no investigation” policy in our faces on your forum?
Perhaps, in order to save this tit for tat, site vs. site stuff, a MT representative (Kaith?) with authority to speak about this situation and the reasoning of why will explain their side’s response or lack there of?