I saw a book on JKD today and I began to wonder what makes JKD different from other martial arts, and I began to realize that JKD is not just a martial art, but an all-encompassing concept.
The basic premise of JKD is to keep what is useful and discard what is useless. In this way then MMA and JKD are the same thing in essence. They differ mainly because at the time Bruce Lee created it there was no real way of putting all those techniques to the test like we can today with the UFC, so Bruce simply gathered the moves he found to be the most theorically effective, without being able to proof-test it. I think modern MMA is the natural evolution of the JKD concept, and if Bruce Lee would still be alive, he would watch mixed martial art events and say: This is what I’ve been dreaming about all along. What bothers me is that JKD became a brand name martial art (as opposed to JKD CONCEPTS) and people are making the same mistakes all over again. We all know that JKD as taught by bruce lee in the sixties doesn’t work that well in no hold barred competition, and the logic thing to do according the the JKD philosophy is to discard what once was tought to be useful and replace it with what really is useful. Thus the modern MMA fighting style. I think if bruce lee would still be alive there would be no JKD style as a style like it has become now.
JKD is a brand name, JKD concepts is a way of thinking. I am currently playing the original Final Fantasy Tactics, and it could be seen as an expression of JKD. Putting maple syrup in your pie instead of sugar could be JKD. Believing in some aspect of a religion and not in the whole thing could be JKD etc etc. My fighting style is mainly Muay Thai, but I still call it JKD concepts because I won’t be restricted by a particular style. I am not impressed by the JKD instructors these days… they missed the point entirely. They’re doing everything bruce said was wrong.
This is an on going debate between those who believe in the concept of JKD and those that believe it as a style. Be ready to argue with those who believe in the style pursuit.
Personally, I agree with the concept and dislike the idea of branding MMA training.
Also, couldn’t you just post this as a response in a pre-existing JKD thread. I don’t feel this is a great way to start a thread.
[quote=Demon Eyes;2284669]This is an on going debate between those who believe in the concept of JKD and those that believe it as a style. Be ready to argue with those who believe in the style pursuit.
Personally, I agree with the concept and dislike the idea of branding MMA training.
Also, couldn’t you just post this as a response in a pre-existing JKD thread. I don’t feel this is a great way to start a thread.[/quote]
of course threads will come out that are similar to older threads, but that can’t be helped, since pretty much everything as been said before at one point or another :dontknow:
For those who belive in JKD as a style, they are going against what Lee’s was saying all the time.
[quote=Osaka peach;2284673]of course threads will come out that are similar to older threads, but that can’t be helped, since pretty much everything as been said before at one point or another :dontknow:
For those who belive in JKD as a style, they are going against what Lee’s was saying all the time.[/quote]
not neccesarrily, to be honest jeet kun do refers to the way of the intercepting fist. This was a reference to his counter stiking method of longest weapon to the nearest target. It’s very reminscent of wing chun’s simultaneous attack and deefense and it’s proven very effective in MMA. The more I watch the big knockouts, the more I’m realizing they are usually counter punches with good power added to the fact that the guy’s coming in to attack and his momentum multiplies it.
Bruce placed a alot of emphasis on this as well as attacking the weapon idea from philipino arts.
[quote=wingchunx2z;2284682]not neccesarrily, to be honest jeet kun do refers to the way of the intercepting fist. This was a reference to his counter stiking method of longest weapon to the nearest target. It’s very reminscent of wing chun’s simultaneous attack and deefense and it’s proven very effective in MMA. The more I watch the big knockouts, the more I’m realizing they are usually counter punches with good power added to the fact that the guy’s coming in to attack and his momentum multiplies it.
Bruce placed a alot of emphasis on this as well as attacking the weapon idea from philipino arts.
Afterwards he found that even this idea was too limited and he changed to use w/e works.[/quote]
The intercepting fist idea is the main focus of my practice, and what may differentiate it from standard Muay Thai from an outside point of view :happy8:
but JKD as taught in the sixties almost completely ignored grappling issues, as with 95 per cent of martial arts at the time. It was a work in progress, and lee did not grasp the importance of takedown, grappling and groundwork (nor did anybody else at the time anyway). The JKD of the sixties is the embryonic stage, which was frozen in time when Lee died, with people refusing to see beyond his immediate work and findings.
[quote=Osaka peach;2284689]The intercepting fist idea is the main focus of my practice, and what may differentiate it from standard Muay Thai from an outside point of view :happy8:
but JKD as taught in the sixties almost completely ignored grappling issues, as with 95 per cent of martial arts at the time. It was a work in progress, and lee did not grasp the importance of takedown, grappling and groundwork (nor did anybody else at the time anyway). The JKD of the sixties is the embryonic stage, which was frozen in time when Lee died, with people refusing to see beyond his immediate work and findings.[/quote]
While I understand your point I’d again slightly disagree. Bruce was well aware of the existance of the ground and takedowns.
His understanding of the limitations of striking ability on the ground is apparent here and it also shows his understanding of the sprawl and headlock as an attack. His response is based on life/death and simplicity. He may not be using a BJJ defense or a wrestling re shoot and dump. But I think he was very aware of the ground and what it does to a standup fighter. YouTube- Bruce Lee - The Art of Dying
[quote=wingchunx2z;2284707]While I understand your point I’d again slightly disagree. Bruce was well aware of the existance of the ground and takedowns.
His understanding of the limitations of striking ability on the ground is apparent here and it also shows his understanding of the sprawl and headlock as an attack. His response is based on life/death and simplicity. He may not be using a BJJ defense or a wrestling re shoot and dump. But I think he was very aware of the ground and what it does to a standup fighter. YouTube- Bruce Lee - The Art of Dying[/quote]
He certainly was aware of grappling, but I think he underestimated it’s importance, because neither Fighting Method nor TOJKD mentions anything worthwile on any kind of grappling whatsoever. I know he once said that bitting was the solution to grappling but in this day and age of AIDS and stuff I’m not sure it’s a good idea. :tongue5:
[quote=Osaka peach;2284714]He certainly was aware of grappling, but I think he underestimated it’s importance, because neither Fighting Method nor TOJKD mentions anything worthwile on any kind of grappling whatsoever. I know he once said that bitting was the solution to grappling but in this day and age of AIDS and stuff I’m not sure it’s a good idea. :tongue5:[/quote]Underestimated?
"Bruce loved to learn grappling, he ate it up! He said that people would never go for it in movies or TV because the fights are over too fast and most of the good stuff was hidden from view. He said they wanted to see fancy kicking, acrobatics, and weapons – he was a savvy showman who knew how to give 'em exactly what they wanted. I wish he could be around now to see how well grappling is doing these days. I remember one time he kicked me really hard. I remember thinking it was a good thing he only wore a size 6 shoe instead of a 14 like me, otherwise that kick would have sent me to China! He was strong for his size, lemme tell ya.
It does not matter what it is called, the jeet kune do concept of a buffet approach, how do you know what you learn is effective? If you do not have a good understanding of a good delivery system, you can learn all the “style” of martial art in the world and still not get it.
[quote=Osaka peach;2284734]oh c’mon! not AGAIN! :icon_eek:
you better not come up with your technobabble this time! :eusa_snoo[/quote]
Since you obviously do not know the word you just typed, continue to enjoy another crappy thread.
My 2 cents
While I think it’s a good idea to preserve the teaching and techniques that Bruce Lee gave us while he was alive , I think it’s not the best idea to keep them static like a fly in amber .
I find it odd that you will hear less about what the founder would have wanted when visting a Shotokan karate school or a Judo club then when visting some JKD schools . I took Judo for many years reaching 2cd degree brown belt and never during that time did anyone even give a thought about what Professor Kano would have wanted . I think that JKD would probably be better off if it founder were not as well known this why more us would have to stand on our merit instead of being able to bring up Bruce Lee to prove a point or try to .
I consider myself lucky in that I’ve been able to train with first and second generation students of Bruce Lee but in my experience , including working as a teacher in schools for mental distrubed students and innercity schools , when things went bad no one seems to care how close you are to bruce lee
