I recently joined a Krav Maga school affliated with www.tacticalkravmaga.com.au
They conduct 7 and 5 days instructor’s courses in Pattaya Thailand. Has anyone had experience with them? I’d like to bullshido proof them before I drop money into their courses. =)
Anyone?
“Is this BS” questions don’t go in this forum. What do you have to accomplish before going to the instructor seminar? Do they spar?
Yea they torally, suck. Balls even.
The trip to Pattaya Thailand is a great idea, the rest sounds like someone else is jumping on the Krav bandwagon.
Good question. They emailed me back and said the only requirements are be that i be over 18, fit, and payed in full by the payment due date.
Sounds lax
[quote=Burningman;2189861]Good question. They emailed me back and said the only requirements are be that i be over 18, fit, and payed in full by the payment due date.
Sounds lax[/quote]
They are going to slip you a roofie, steal a kidney and a lung. While you are still under anaesthesia, a large American tourist is going to use you like a blow up doll.
Why is everything always titled TACTICAL? Is there a strategic or operational self-defense school? Do you spar on the internet?
[quote=asscowboy;2189870]
Why is everything always titled TACTICAL? [/quote]
To imply a military-type cred without the obligations of…you know…actually having to serve.
Its LARPer bait.
Aye, I have experience of Tactical Krav Maga Pattaya Thailand ! 
There is great fun to be had, do not worry re the KM training, its good, think
of all the other things more exciting. (I lead a v boring life in Pattaya , but visitors seem
to enjoy the attractions & festivities)
As Bruce Lee said re students debating the true meaning of words Jeet Kune Do,
his students looking for something that was not there. Bruce being a hot head,
a short tempered said something like “It’s only a name!!!” !!!
Krav Maga is only a means to an end -> saving ones butt if attacked.
But since you asked…
Tactical Krav Maga is the method of Krav Maga Itay Gil (Human Weapon krav maga documentary), developed mainly through live hands on experience, in Yamam unit & later when he KM head instructor of I.D.F. (He still trains the elite sayaret duvdevan unit today, even though he is service in IDF has been finished. re his experience being top notch). TKM is v similar to what Itay instructed to elite units, its not technique orientated, as all is pressure tested full contact so you will find out very fast what works for you personally or not, when doing live all out full contact TKM fighting - which is the technique never goes as planned, & one has to improvise on the concept , & figure it out on the stop, while not getting a whacking.
Tactical Krav Maga covers all same defenses etc of other KM systems, with about 70% less technique & its simple, basic & full on, & informal.
If you went to Israel to train with Itay Gil or another variation of his KM & great web site lots of info is your-krav-maga-expert.com (or my-krav url might be) Moshe Katz, you will find those guys work much hand gun in their defenses, as their all packing & re the situation over there conflict etc. ) While In Thailand, we not packing (well us foreigners are not packing guns, though Thai citizens most have guns at home legal & licensed), we would be focusing on using the dirty strikes to end an attack as opposed to shooting attacker.
When I changed from KM to Itays system, I really liked in, & since I was dual training in muay thai 6 - 11 times a week when I “converted” to TKM, I found it very similar to muay thai, & I described tactical krav maga (civilian self defense ) as street version of muay thai with combatives & dirty fighting.
Its simple to learn, just a bit of grit needed, for the contact drills,
& no we do not wrapped our hands in pink hand wraps which seems to be the fashion in krav these days! LOL! 
Krav Maga Pattaya Thailand Seminar Video Clip
If link not work go to youtube.com/kravmagathailand
also info on www.krav-maga-fist.com
I do not think there is an Instructor course in Thailand until June 2010 (which I think is an approx TBC date).
I find Tactical Krav Maga to be a good system, however it does have its imperfections like all other systems & I am not a “purist” of TKM. If Irish Ceili Dancing will get in a better result in a street fight, I will use to Ceili Dancing.
A punch is a punch is a punch. there is only 2 type of punch (or strike etc)
a GOOD PUNCH & a BAD PUNCH. Shoot for the Good Punch as best as the situation allows… or if you ever been bottled (beer bottle slash attack or whack over head – I have several times,working nightclubs etc)… Your lucky if you can fight through & survive, as it Hurts Like Hell… getting hit with a beer bottle… regardless if it is Bud, Heinienken or Guinness… what brand of beer bottle the bottle attacker uses does not factor at all. (if ya see da bigger picture I am meaning re street self defense?)
I have been training with the IKMF but will switch to TKM. I own a security and bodyguard company in Central America. From a security stand point, I would trust Itay Gil with his background and experience in teaching. Do not confuse TKM with CKM - Moni is total BS! I trained with an IDF instructor from Isreal ( Shachar Klafeld ) who stated some of Moni’s stuff really put people in dangerous positions. TKM looks a bit more sloppy than the IKMF, but it’s designed to be full - contact, stress training. The free style training is effective in teaching students reactions. In any street confrontation, who can predict how things will play out? So you train people by constantly putting them in new positions where they are forced to fight, attack, escape, utilize weapons nearby, creat distance, close distance…so on. To learn Krav Maga from a military instructor was gold for me. Techniques are designed from studies of real life attacks. When the instructor said “we teach this technique this way because…” this was eye opening. Before hearing the explinations I always asked, “now why would they do that”? when watching the youtube videos. After hearing the explinations from a military instructor it made sense. I then realized that much of the Krav Maga that I did know had to be corrected because as this sport spreads…it slowly slips from it’s core and what it was designed to accomplish. That is why I will only study with Israeli instructors or their first chosen rep. After that I think it’s unavoidable to receive a little watered down KM. Also remember that many of the American Krav Maga instructors were TKD, Kenpo, Judo, or other type of instructors who added this to their school’s program. When I traveled through the US I could not find one instructor ( besides David Khan) who could answer questions like the military instructor on why the moves were created in the fashion they were. Amazing that people can teach a sport while knowing so little about it. The military instructor also explained to me that a few organizations have isolated themselves from the continued development of Krav Maga. This is why you will see some organizations changing or updating while you will see others teaching the same techniques with little or know change at all.
I’m very impressed with this TKM ad thread. This should probably be moved to YMAS where it can be properly appreciated.
Good job moving this thread mods. What else do you do for foolish under wraps?
I hope you’re ready to be properly appreciated. :ky:
Watch Closely.
Yes -> " TKM looks a bit more sloppy "
You are correct!
Consider & perhaps some of you can relate to this. From my own personal martial arts journey, Full Contact Kick Boxing be it good sparring in gym or ring where ante upped a bit, we can still do v clean technical moves,(non sloppy) set up with ring strategy/fight plan. Nice combos that KO & look good. (great examples, check out kick boxing greats like Benny the Jet or Bill “Super foot” Wallace (only had 5 strikes, only could kick with left leg too Bill Wallace) see their kick boxing bouts of youtube. full contact, great strategy, & for most part looks good - not “sloppy” )
But regardless of where in the world I have been from Ireland, North American, S America, Asia, Europe, there is ONE thing i have never seen & that one thing I have yet to see. what is it?
A Street Fight that is “not sloppy”!
(I take 5th amendment as yanks say on question did I only witness or did I ever part take in any of these street situations!)
Krav maga, let us leave side for one minute because I am going to quote (approx) words world class street self defense (civilian) innovator & a man whose DVDs are well worth studying & he has the street experience is
Geoff Thompson. Animal Day DVD or 3 Second Fighter DVD where is students are fighting full out e.g. punches vs kicker only, & the all out, (not combat sport angle but close as one can train for real street in gym).
It is Sloppy as hell!
Geoff comes on at end of DVD & he says to camera
" Sloppy is n’t it? Its very sloppy is what other martial arts people might say. But in that Sloppiness there is a Beauty & that Beauty is my guys are training for as close to the real thing (street fight) as possible. "
I think that is an excellent comment from an extremely experienced martial artist who has 300+ street fights in his Bouncer days. (Geoff claims 300+ is nothing, some of his former colleagues, if you read his book “Watch My Back” Geoff referred on his blog, that Jon Anderson had over 800+ street fights & Jon Anderson was not a martial arts nor boxer. Geoff said he had 1 move… a ferocious right hook! (and pre-strike deception, to set up thug). Not that I advocate street fighting, I mention this as it shows the experience in
civilian street self defense these guys have.
So yes, aside from in training in Krav Maga Thailand, especially me instructing beginners to intermediate & this goes for any Martial Artor Combat sport or self defense or krav maga, it is best if one can get them to focus some of their time on good technicals & basics & getting their strikes looking good.
Especially IMO, body mechanics, hip torque, snap, recoil, moving on feet fast, bob slip weave… sounds like boxing or kick boxing training? Yes I find with my own regular guys here in Krav Maga Thailand Pattaya , especially those who are not “naturals” I can get much better progression & improvement results when I put Tactical Krav Maga aside for a few classes per month, & get them boxing & kick boxing, they really start to build an investment in their skills which in time will reward them massive return in their self defence krav maga if they ever have to defend themselves on the street using the combatives & krav maga I teach them.
During this, we still from very early days of a beginner to Pattaya Krav Maga Thailand, get them to do the fighting “milling” (like the “Milling” fighting British Army Paras do in P Company basic training, see youtube) & it is sloppy to be sure like in the Tactical Krav Maga Thailand Video clip I posted. But I really try at that stage to hammer to krav maga learners mind the differences & WHY of each style of instructing them the way I do. Of course later in all comes together & more effective reaching “sloppy - in the sloppy there is a beauty” reality self defense fighting Geoff Thompson speaks of. (Real Punching Vol I Geoff Thompson DVD is a 3rd dvd I highly recommend from him. he speaks great wisdom & a “Think & Grow Rich” type secret key to training for street fight self defense Geoff reveals if you listen & reflect on what he says from min 58 - 60 mins at end of real punching dvd).
Tactical is just a name, as far as I can see, to the “style” of Krav Maga I am Instructor in that comes from Itay Gil. As I mentioned already Itays top guy Moshe Katz who does seminars all over world, he does not call his method of krav maga from Itay Gil Tactical Krav Maga, its no different than if you called it “The Krav Maga From Itay Gil People”.
Now there is over 300 pages on Moshe Katz Krav Maga web site, which gives all the total insight in to what REAL krav maga as by Itay Gils innovations, through very “hands on” real world (life or death) experience he had in Yamam etc…
(It not correct for me to tell on here, but when he was here in Thailand Krav Maga Seminars, just amazing what & how he teaches. He is open to explaining
some of this real world “hands on” experiences, & it makes interesting for reflection, analysis & learning & how to amend your training, based on his real world wisdom).
It is a Bible of krav maga go to now -> www.your-krav-maga-expert.com
I am probably going to offend a few people, but Krav Maga the only Israeli thing about it is the Hebrew words Krav Maga & of course how real world experience of “some” krav maga instructors is high quality real world insight ! WHY?
Ever hear of a few lads called W.E. Fairbairn & Sykes & O’Neill ?
Developed in 1920s a Simple Basic Brutal Fighting Method to be learn in a short period of time original for Police, later taught to WWII Allied Commando Units & to me more relevant the Allied - Special Operations Executive SOE (later to become MI6 & one Ian Fleming who wrote 007 books was in SOE) & the American WWII ( see Col Rex Applegate) OSS which later spawned CIA.
Hand to Hand combat system as taught to “Secret Agents” who operated undercover in Nazi Occupied Europe, often solo. And hand to “Kill with Bare Hands” or a Fairbairn Knife, the SOE agents, often 2 or 3 days was all the time re WWII needs to devote to Hand to Hand Combat training, & then off they went, & many had to “do the job” with the simple basics they learned over 2 - 3 days, other wise endure a long painful death dangling off a Gestapo torture interrogation piano wire.
I have the Instructors, as we say in the corporate world “Train The Trainer” Instructors Manual for training the Combatives SOE program it, well, I would take the opinion - Krav Maga borrowed heavily from this but some how “forgot” the original source of the material along the way, Or the 1930s filmed before Hitler even started throwing shapes video clips of Col. W.E. Fairbarin doing Gun Hold Up Removals (gun to his back) which look very identical to the “invented by IMI krav maga” gun removals… interesting Fairbairn had “invented” very similar Gun Removals about 30 years before.
Not that this really matters, its the result we want, if attacked destroy the attacker, so we are walking away unharmed, thats what matters.
I do think, especially as regards civilian self defense, & the stupid hype marketing of Krav Maga, & Special Forces etc, Special Forces shoot, & from speaking to guys who served in US, UK & other countries Special Units, hand to hand combat is an after thought, or unless of a specialized task is way down the list of their training priority.
A contact who served in Duvdevan unit in IDF, I was asking him & pushing for answers I wanted to hear -
“Tell me more about the real Krav Maga who guys learned for Duvdevan? What is different? Blah Blah Blah!”
Israeli people not that they can be strongly Blunt in communication 
He bluntly made shape of gun with hand & shouted his reply
“THATs THE REAL KRAV MAGA! THAT! AN M16 IS THE REAL KRAV MAGA WE LEARNED & USE!!! OK!!!”
While I was hoping to hear some mystical Kung Fu insight, & was a little disappointed with the initial answer. I realized he was correct in what he said.
Though he did mention, a son Dennis Hanover renamed his method (Hisd… I cant spell it… google it) taught him KM in IDF duvdevan & was excellent.
I think, what you see in Fight Quest when “Jimmy” got hammered in Krav Maga IDF training in Fight Quest… looked very like Dirty Street Fighting Muay Thai when they went live full on fighting in that Krav Maga show Fight Quest.
My OP… I said the same when I chanced to Tactical Krav Maga, it was like dirty street fighting Muay Thai with better KM elements added.
My point about Special Forces guys & guns etc is they train for a specific job.
As civilians who want to learn real street fight self defense, the Special Force Specialist many not be the specialist for “after the pub” street violence which is most common in civilian world. So I mean regardless of what self defense sytems you do, krav maga or other, or regardless of what "style"of krav Maga I think some of the best Civilian street fight material is from Gepff Thompson
& if you have experience enough to pick up elements from his DVDs, it is very easy to, include it, as IMO a MUST add on for your self defense training.
Brings me back to my comment using as example a punch… noit style of punch that matters… what matter is “did it work” & there is only 1 type of punch that matters… a good punch!
Or to again quote Geoff Thompson on Reality Street fight Self Defense training
“It does not matter what colour the cat is… as long as the cat kills mice!”
Slan Leat!
Carl Cestari dvds well worth checking out, he passed away last year, Carl Cestari leading authority on WWII pre WWII Combatives & a martial artist in several systems from days when a black belt was a rite of pain & years of training. if you google gutterfighting (I cant think if .com or .org) you will find an amazing online library of what I consider to be the most effective lethal battle tested hand to hand, knife, stick, & point combat shooting free resource online. There is months of study on there, if you really want serious insight into reality combatives fighting Fairbairn O’Neill Sykes & more.
tl;dr
I read up to the point where you say that you don’t advocate street fighting. I was going to make a bad joke about not advocating Street Fighter because Dead or Alive is a better game, but because you wrote ‘street fighting’ I couldn’t make the joke work.
Then I had a look at your style field and noticed that you’re from Thailand. I couldn’t help but think that was a coincidence because I was listening to Lola by The Kinks, which is a song about, well, something Thailand is known for around here. No, I’m not talking about Muay Thai, although that would be an interesting song. The Kinks are apparently getting back together so we should suggest that.
I’m learning to play the electric bass guitar, the funkiest instrument known to man, and I’ve just finished learning a song by the Red Hot Chilli Peppers. By the way, the bass player of RHCP was born in Australia. Anyway, yesterday my teacher started me on a new song, by The Living End, an Australian band. When I was listening to it I thought to myself that it sounded like a Punk song.
That’s when I realised what a twat I was. The only difference I know between punk and rock is the clothing, so I went on Wikipedia that night to read up on just what exactly punk is. Interestingly it seems I was right; The Living End’s music is considered punk.
While I was reading the punk article I clicked on a link to the article for The Kinks; apparently their music helped influence the creation of punk. One of the things I noticed was that two of the members of The Kinks are brothers with the surname Davies. I don’t remember the first brother’s name because I’m terrible with names, but the second jumped out at me because his name is Dave. Dave Davies. Seriously.
So tonight I was watching Spicks and Specks, a pseudo-quiz music show, and one of the last questions was about The Kinks, specifically what was the name of the second brother. Without thinking I said Dave Davies. For once I actually got a question right on Spicks and Specks, and I answered it before they did on the show. I was quite happy with that.
There we go, my own tl;dr post. All of it is true BTW.
I was also fascinated by the Krav story as I was in Bangcock for a little over a week on a service trip. I had about an hour layover in Japan on the way over so now I can say I have been to Japan but still don’t claim any real knowledge of Japan from the hour that I was there. I do remember that there seemed to be a lot of Japanese people working at the Airport in Japan but at the time that wasn’t really surprising and I still think that is likely not unusual for airports in Japan. I would have been surprised fo sure if there had been a lot of people from Indiana staffing the shops and what not in Japanese Airports. That would really have been unusual I would think. Not that people from Indiana would be poor shop keepers or service workers though. I have met many people from Indiana that seemed very capable of working in Japanese Airports but due to their duties from their current employers, they just didn’t have the time or interests in employment options in the Japanese Airports. There is likely some immigration criterea that would have to be made to persue those options but it would sure take a lot of effort so there didn’t seem to be anyone who was really looking at those options. I’m pretty sure people from other states could work there as well, except maybe people from Oklahoma. Those people seem to be happy to be in Oklahoma and I think they would work in Japanese Airports if the Japanese ever put their Airports in Oklahoma or would buy existing Oklahoma Airports that would employ people from Oklahoma but still be owned by the Japanese people who would buy Airports in Oklahoma. Not all poeple from Oklahoma would want to work there but maybe some would I think.
That is really strange. I was walking down the street yesterday, on the sidewalk of course, not really in the street, and I saw a lot of cars. Not one of them had an Oklahoman plate, but a lot of them were from Japan. I wonder if Japanese people drive cars from Oklahoma.
[quote=Evil Solvalou;2191178]tl;dr
I read up to the point where you say that you don’t advocate street fighting. I was going to make a bad joke about not advocating Street Fighter because Dead or Alive is a better game, but because you wrote ‘street fighting’ I couldn’t make the joke work.
Then I had a look at your style field and noticed that you’re from Thailand. I couldn’t help but think that was a coincidence because I was listening to Lola by The Kinks, which is a song about, well, something Thailand is known for around here. No, I’m not talking about Muay Thai, although that would be an interesting song. The Kinks are apparently getting back together so we should suggest that.
I’m learning to play the electric bass guitar, the funkiest instrument known to man, and I’ve just finished learning a song by the Red Hot Chilli Peppers. By the way, the bass player of RHCP was born in Australia. Anyway, yesterday my teacher started me on a new song, by The Living End, an Australian band. When I was listening to it I thought to myself that it sounded like a Punk song.
That’s when I realised what a twat I was. The only difference I know between punk and rock is the clothing, so I went on Wikipedia that night to read up on just what exactly punk is. Interestingly it seems I was right; The Living End’s music is considered punk.
While I was reading the punk article I clicked on a link to the article for The Kinks; apparently their music helped influence the creation of punk. One of the things I noticed was that two of the members of The Kinks are brothers with the surname Davies. I don’t remember the first brother’s name because I’m terrible with names, but the second jumped out at me because his name is Dave. Dave Davies. Seriously.
So tonight I was watching Spicks and Specks, a pseudo-quiz music show, and one of the last questions was about The Kinks, specifically what was the name of the second brother. Without thinking I said Dave Davies. For once I actually got a question right on Spicks and Specks, and I answered it before they did on the show. I was quite happy with that.
There we go, my own tl;dr post. All of it is true BTW.[/quote]