From what I’ve read and been told Tae Kwan Do and Shotokan Karate are almost exactly the sames due to Japan’s occupation of Korea. However, I know Funakoshi incorporated a few Judo throws into Shotokan (only a few I have been told out of “respect” for Kano, whatever that means). So does anybody know why there are no throws/grappling in TKD if Shotokan had them? Also does aybody know why is it that Shotokan rarely teaches throws and grappling even though it had some from both Kano and Okinawan katas Funakoshi taught? Also does anybody have any strong opinions about Shojiro Sugiyama?
First, Shotokan and TKD are COMPLETELY Different. Well, no there not, shotokan uses kicks. The principles taught in it and the effectiveness in situations is different.
Could you please explain in more detail the katas are very similar except for a couple that are uniquely Korean. My main question though is why there is some grappling in Shotokan and not in TKD. Thanks.
There’s about as much grappling in TKD as there is in shotokan.
I have a couple of articles on the different kwans that formed TKD, so I won’t go into extensive detail. However, here is a quick summary.
Many of the Kwan leaders that formed the base of TKD came from Shotokan schools. Now note, I said many, not all. In the beginning formation fo TKD there were only 8 basic punches and kics there were no spin kicks jumping kicks and anything of that natures. If there was any judo moves that were incorporated into Shotokan, I don’t believe they were passed on to the people who started TKD. Now this may be that they were out of the schools prior to the implementation of the judo techniques into Shotokan. Also the founders of TKD did not learn directly under Funakoshi, they learned under his black belts so again, they may not have been taught those methods.
Now why did I say most, not all? The Jidokwan founders first established a school in a Judo school. So the students of the Judo school would also take the karate class. This resulted in some judo techniques being taught in the Jidokwan system. Will you see it now? Very rarely. During the formation of TKD many of the techniques fo the different kwans were lost due to assimulating everything under one system. However, there were some teachers that did keep teaching the techniques within the system.
So, bottom line, TKD, as we know it today, does not have the judo techniques within the system. If you find a school that does have them, most likely it is because the instructor had formal training in Judo (or something to that extent). I hope this helps.
alot of the stuff from TKD comes from the older stuff like Hwrang do. If I’m correct.
Originally posted by Nightstrike
alot of the stuff from TKD comes from the older stuff like Hwrang do. If I’m correct.
You’re not, read the history section.
IF you are correct.
Re: shotokan and Tae Kwon Do
Originally posted by chicagoguy
From what I’ve read and been told Tae Kwan Do and Shotokan Karate are almost exactly the sames due to Japan’s occupation of Korea. However, I know Funakoshi incorporated a few Judo throws into Shotokan (only a few I have been told out of “respect” for Kano, whatever that means). So does anybody know why there are no throws/grappling in TKD if Shotokan had them? Also does aybody know why is it that Shotokan rarely teaches throws and grappling even though it had some from both Kano and Okinawan katas Funakoshi taught? Also does anybody have any strong opinions about Shojiro Sugiyama?
Uhm Funakoshi didn’t incorporate Judo throws. I hear pple say that alot because the don’t know what the fuck they are talking about. Next person to tell you that slap them and them the the STFU you will do a world of good.
The throws in Shotokan come form the native arts in the Ryukyu. Yes there was grappling in Ryukyu arts but not much.
Choi did base alot of TKD off of Shotokan. This he said himself. It is also apparent in the first hyung sets. They were all Shotokan kata but with korean names. As time when on some changes were made to make TKD more Korean.
I’ve only seen Sugiyama’s Shotokan Kata book. Its pretty good for a kata reference. If I remeber correctly it came in 3 langauages. English, Spanish, and Japanese. I used to have the book but lost it years ago.
Originally posted by Nightstrike
alot of the stuff from TKD comes from the older stuff like Hwrang do. If I’m correct.
No you are NOT correct.
*oops Brand said it already. But it came from me so it carries more weight!
Originally posted by Nightstrike
alot of the stuff from TKD comes from the older stuff like Hwrang do. If I’m correct.
AHHHHHH!!! MY EYES ARE BLEEDING FROM READING THIS!!! MAKE HIM STOP! MAKE HIM STOP!
BTW…You are not correct.
Brand said it
Asia second the motion
I am now making it official
If your instructor tells you differently then please proceed to knee him in the groin for me and refer him to this site for future CORRECT information on the origins of TKD.
Um allright I’l go read the history thread…
With the formation of the WTF a good majority (since WTF is most widespread now) of TKD schools had to standardize to whatever the Kukkiwon wanted. Which resulted in the craptacular style of TKD today. If there were any throws or grappling the kukkiwon probably fukked them in the ass and threw it out the window.
About TKD grappling.
WTF has no grappling unless you call grappling clinching your opponent and wait for the referee stoppage.
However, some instructors (especially the korean ones, in my personal experience) have some background in Yudo (Korean Judo) and/or ssyrum (folkstyle korean wrestling), but these techniques are not in the WTF TKD curriculum.
i dont know man
Thank You… now please fuck off and die. Note this is not the standard Bullshido STFU N00b… I really want you to fuck off and die.
It’s so mysterious the way aZnInVaZn or ChEcHwReCk or however he chooses to embarass himself lists his style as “Unknown”. WE SHOULD CALL HIM MR. X AND MAKE HIS AVATAR A BIG QUESTION MARK.
You’re telling me that this idiot is a theme troll? He looks to be a few steps father down the internet evolutionary ladder.
I have heard TKD referred to as Korean Karate before…but that was on the internet…we all know the internet’s true purpose; destruction through misinformation!
When TKD first hit US, Korean karate was probably the best way to describe it was that was exactly what is was. The Korean version of karate. Plus, karate was more of a house hold name than taekwondo back in the 60’s so it was easier to advertise you were a Korean karate school and get students than it was to advertise Korean TKD school.
Plus that term was also popular due to Sun Duk Son’s book Korean Karate, which, I believe was the first English writtent book on Taekwondo offered in the US. So it is not misinformation that you are reading, you were just misinformed to begin with.