This is likely a case of “search function, n00b”, but I figured I’d ask:
I’m training for a pankration tournament at the end of the month. Anybody have any good strategies for that ruleset? I’ve been working on attacking the liver and throwing leg kicks. My groundwork is sub par (anyone at the throwdown could attest to that) so I plan on staying upright.
I fought amatuer pankration in San Diego (SoCal pankration, right?)
Forget the leg kicks, you really wanna focus on your clinch game. The leg kicks get zero points, and without head punches to set them up, they’re pretty worthless. Yeah, you might put the hurt on someone, but my experience was that most good grapplers are just gonna eat the one leg kick you throw to come in for the takedown.
Most pankration fights go to the clinch. Work on your game there. Get good clinch wrestling skills, good throws from the clinch (no spiking though), good offense and defense. Hand strikes are also the way to go, along with throwing elbows from the guard (they rack up points fast). You pretty much wanna keep both feet on the ground as much as you can, because without head strikes, kicking is really tricky against a guy who just wants to shoot in on ya.
I tried to gear this mostly towards striking, as per your question, but I can go into more detail about general strategy in pankration with my limited experience (3 fights: 1-2-0) if you want and the mods permit it.
We’ve been working a lot of clinch work, but I don’t know if I’m much competition for someone with a solid wrestling or judo background. Oh well.
Isn’t there some kind of rule against using elbow strikes? Something about not using the point, but you can use the end of the forearm to hit (the part most of us call the elbow).
Yeah, exactly. You won’t be landing any spike elbows, but those forearm strikes are easy to land from guard, and rack up points.
Remember, you’re only fighting 1 round a fight, so for the most part, you want to rack up points in striking. That’s another reason leg kicks don’t have must place. You aren’t going to rack up exhaustion on him for later rounds, it’s just an opportunity that could be spent scoring strikign points with something worth while.
Work on your sprawls, drill your striking from the ground (again, the more you hit, the more you score), drill standing up from the ground (so you can hit him again to score points), and really work on getting/avoiding unfavorable situations as best as you can. It’s not like training for a boxing match or MMA fight with rounds; you wanna have a blitzkreig mentality. Hit him with everything you got as fast as you can so that, when the round ends, the judges don’t even need to look at the score cards to see who won.
Good luck with that.
As a grappler who fought under pankration rules recently, I agree with most of what emevas is saying, however I do think leg kicks have their place - in my second fight I spent most of the first minute eating leg kicks and after I got the fight to the ground and ended up getting my opponent in a fairly tight triangle, I think part of the reason I couldn’t finish it was that my left leg just felt dead from the punishment it had taken on the feet. So, for whatever that’s worth.
Also, really work on not going to the ground, escaping to a position from which you can stand up if you do get there, and automatically standing up any time you get the chance - if he tries for the takedown, you wind up in his guard and he leaves it too lose, stand the fuck up, maybe attack his legs a bit, then back off so he stands up. This will allow you to play your game and from experiencing this it’s extremely frustrating and demoralising to finally get a superior striker to the ground, only to have him stand up and have to try to do it all over again.
Hope that helps, take whatever I say with a pinch of salt as my striking sucks and I’ve only had two pankration fights.
If you’re gonna kick make sure it’s low and fast. Stick and move and use your FMA footwork to your advantage. i.e. Low rear thai kick off diamond footwork and angle out and away. Don’t let him close the distance and stuff you with typical straight forward kickboxing. Practice on balance with a caught leg and clinching with a caught leg to escaping. (Not being able to punch the head will hurt you on this though unfortunately).
Circle away and hit from a takedown attempt and learn to sprawl like a champ. Also, Das Moose is the correct. If you get taken down go to guard if possible. When he goes to pass create enough space and quickly explode out and back to your feet. Frustrate your opponent. Can’t say enough about footwork and not over committing your kicks.
Most important… get video.
edit: I plan on going to watch. IM me as the date gets closer so I can recognize you. ie… RE, I’m the guy with the red afro, tattoo of a nun on my face and the Sprawl Prison Jumpsuit with solitary stripes.
I’ll be the guy that doesn’t look like he should weigh 185-190, probably underneath some grappler.
Cocos, where is the tournament btw??? And good luck!!!
Yeah, where is this tourney at? How far is it from the throwdown we had? I wouldn’t mind seeing it. Are Pankration rules similiar to San Shou?
I’m really not sure where its even going to be. I’ll try to find out when I train this weekend.
Basically, pankration rules allow hand strikes, kicks and knees to the body and legs, fighting from the clinch, and groundfighting. No head contact, so it favors the grappler. I’ve developed the weird habit of striking with chops to the ribs while groundfighting.
Knees to the liver are allowed and teh deadly. Work pummeling and knee the side that you have an underhook on. That makes it harder for them to grab the knee. I doubt you will be able to get a thai clinch on a good wrestler but its worth a shot.
Unfortunately everyone is right. It is plain hard to keep a fight standing without head shots.
PS if your clinch takedowns are bad learn how to pull guard into an immediate sweep.
This is all general advice as I’ve never fought Pankration rules.
The pull guard to sweep is something I’m alright at doing from a clinch.
At this point I think I’m pretty much as prepared as I’ll get.
http://www.fightleague.org/images/TournamentInfo/2007CAPankrationChamptionship/2007CaliforniaChampionshipsFlyer.pdf
Here’s the flyer. Anyone else giong to be there?