I derailed a MABS thread

[quote=Cy Q. Faunce;2301334]You’re in over your head. Admit it and find a way to remedy your deficiency. Consult someone knowledgeable. Don’t just bluff your way through this.

You don’t want to end up as 2010’s answer to The Mystery of Al Capone’s Vault, do you?[/quote]

You know, I gave you kudos for your stuff that you linked to in your other post, but not for nothing - what qualifications do you have to say what someone should or shouldn’t do as far as their work is concerned? Are you a paid and professional writer? If so, have you covered anything else besides MMA?

I’m not trying to sound like a dick or make any insinuations, but this is a career for me and I have attained a certain amount of credentials over the years I have been doing this covering sports and bodybuilding and built a name for myself.

Besides that, I have already said on more than one occasion that I am interested in covering a fight, not become a federal investigator. If that’s what you want to hang your hat on, then go ahead.

[quote=It is Fake;2301335]I asked you a question you can stop with the martyr bit.

Shut up with the martyr syndrome. No one is killing the messenger. You refuse to ask hard question, then complain because no one called the show. You want to be a journalist? You are getting your feet wet? Then do your job the way you like. Don’t complain and hide behind platitudes when people question your skills. You set yourself up as an intermediary not a journalist. If we look at all of your posts, you are an advertiser, a journalist and an intermediary as well. You have sat here, since you started posting, playing all three sides.

Until this is resolved you are going to get picked apart.[/quote]

I have no idea what the fuck you’re talking about by bringing ‘martyr’ into the equation. I admitted freely that I knew nothing about legal documents. What was the problem with answering something truthfully?

Plus, I didn’t complain that no one of any substance called the show, but merely agreeing with someone else about being disappointed. I asked Christian basically all of the infamous 20 questions, so your claim that I do not ask hard questions has no validity to it. If you had something else burning inside you to ask him, you could have easily called in or posted something the day before and I would have been more than happy to mention it that day on the air.

I have no problem with people questioning my skills because I feel that I have enough to back it up. I even wrote that I welcomed criticism.

And, no - I do not WANT to be a journalist, I am one. I’ve covered the last three Super Bowls and wrote the cover feature on Ron Artest for the December issue of “Fitness RX for Men,” just to give a few examples.

So feel free to pick me apart. And I don’t need to hide behind anything.

[quote=Joe Pietaro;2301394]I have no idea what the fuck you’re talking about by bringing ‘martyr’ into the equation. I admitted freely that I knew nothing about legal documents. What was the problem with answering something truthfully?

Plus, I didn’t complain that no one of any substance called the show, but merely agreeing with someone else about being disappointed. I asked Christian basically all of the infamous 20 questions, so your claim that I do not ask hard questions has no validity to it. If you had something else burning inside you to ask him, you could have easily called in or posted something the day before and I would have been more than happy to mention it that day on the air.

I have no problem with people questioning my skills because I feel that I have enough to back it up. I even wrote that I welcomed criticism.

And, no - I do not WANT to be a journalist, I am one. I’ve covered the last three Super Bowls and wrote the cover feature on Ron Artest for the December issue of “Fitness RX for Men,” just to give a few examples.

So feel free to pick me apart. And I don’t need to hide behind anything.[/quote]

I don’t claim to speak for other (far more experienced) members here but I think what it basically boils down to is that you’re being advised to tread carefully here and question everything. Approaching this solely from the perspective of covering a sporting event may lead to you being duped and used by a (potentially) fraudulent martial artist for publicity purposes.

No-one wants to see that - least of all you, I’d guess.

CD has made some extraordinary claims, which as someone else already mentioned require extraordinary evidence to back them up. If it all turns out to be true and he can prove it all, then more power to him - but it would be very unwise to allow this to go any further until you are 100% convinced that CD is ‘the real deal’. You really do need to have your ‘suspicious, investigative’ head on with this and take every step possible to ensure that any ‘proof’ you may be shown really is proof and be seriously prepared to call BS on the whole thing and disconnect completely if you’re at all suspicious, or your questions are not being answered to your satisfaction.

Don’t be the guy who sticks his neck out - and ends up getting his head chopped off.

Heh, I don’t suppose that you expected all this when you first decided to cover the story… :redx:

Yes and yes. I’ve published one book and several articles. None were any great success, but nevertheless they got published and I got paid.

None of that matters, however, any more than it’s okay for a martial arts teacher being questioned to demand that all of his questioners be paid martial arts instructors. Any reasonable person can question something.

The fact that you’re getting paid to do the wrong thing doesn’t make it acceptable.

Saying this is usually a sign that this is exactly what one is doing.

All the more reason to be careful to protect the value of that name and reputation.

I’m not asking you to become a Federal investigator. (Exaggerate much?) I want to know why you aren’t asking the obvious questions. This doesn’t require that you become a shamus, or even that you hire one. It merely requires that you act like an actual journalist and find out some underlying facts.

Delegating this responsibility to the members of this forum while condescending to us (because you got paid! for an article! with words and everything!) is not acceptable.

[quote=It is Fake;2301397]Kill the messenger. Messenger becomes a martyr.

Actually you became indignant but, this is becoming a derail.

Anyway. If you need further help I’ll get you some of your posts.

Woah where did I say anything about people of “substance” needed to call?

Alright, I won’t split hairs with you on this one.

Yes, it does but, I’m derailing. I’ll leave this one alone for now.

I had no questions. I don’t like the advertising slant this thread has taken. It feels like the website is being used to promote CD not investigate CD.

Yes, this is a long thread so, people don’t always remember what they type. I was not clear so, I will apologize for lack of clarity.

This is what I am referring to and why I used the quotes in my post.

I am operating from your “feet wet” comment in MMA. So, you are new to MMA journalism.[/quote]

‘Don’t kill the messenger’ was merely being used as a figure of speech. And I never said that you wrote ‘substance.’ I wrote it. I was putting words in my own mouth.

I am not promoting Christian in any way other than he is scheduled to have a fight with James, who I am also covering. I actually am working on the article this evening from our interview last week. And I have stated that I have spoken to Peter Storm about covering the UCL in general, so I don’t agree with your assessment.

I don’t see MMA being such a drastic change from what I have been covering for years now and although I only have started to cover it regularly of late, I did previously write articles on the sport. Perhaps the UG scene has its own identity that I have not been exposed to, and that was the reason why I generalized when I used the “getting my feet wet” remark.

[quote=Cy Q. Faunce;2301418]Yes and yes. I’ve published one book and several articles. None were any great success, but nevertheless they got published and I got paid.

None of that matters, however, any more than it’s okay for a martial arts teacher being questioned to demand that all of his questioners be paid martial arts instructors. Any reasonable person can question something.

The fact that you’re getting paid to do the wrong thing doesn’t make it acceptable.

Saying this is usually a sign that this is exactly what one is doing.

All the more reason to be careful to protect the value of that name and reputation.

I’m not asking you to become a Federal investigator. (Exaggerate much?) I want to know why you aren’t asking the obvious questions. This doesn’t require that you become a shamus, or even that you hire one. It merely requires that you act like an actual journalist and find out some underlying facts.

Delegating this responsibility to the members of this forum while condescending to us (because you got paid! for an article! with words and everything!) is not acceptable.[/quote]
Let’s just say that we will agree to disagree and probably not see eye-to-eye on everything.

With that said, I really don’t give a flying fuck what you perceive to be acceptable or not concerning the route that I am taking in covering this fight. I am not looking to out anyone as a fraud and the only reason why I “delegated” that task to the members is because that seems to be more on their agenda than mine.

I do not need to defend myself as far as my work goes, but if someone tries to take me to task then I have no problem bringing up instances to thwart that criticism. Any correlation to that sounding condescending was unintentional.

Hypothetically, if you tried to tell your mechanic that he was fixing your car wrong, he would explain to you what he was doing and how many times he has diagnosed and rectified a similar situation.

The bottom line is that I am covering this story for my readers and they are more interested in the sporting side of it. The fight itself and who won and why. Not that I was able to debunk a claim or not by one of the participants.

So your readers don’t care about Darrow’s grandiose claims and the truth behind them, if any?

Swell. Don’t publish the claims. Don’t promote the claims. Problem solved.

[quote=Cy Q. Faunce;2301458]So your readers don’t care about Darrow’s grandiose claims and the truth behind them, if any?

Swell. Don’t publish the claims. Don’t promote the claims. Problem solved.[/quote]

It’s a sports-related media outlet. They’re into that. His claims are not going to help or hurt him in the fight. I’m only taking advantage of the build-up because of all the attention generated on the boards.

If you begin your own sports media company, then feel free to write about anything you wish. I won’t try to influence you in any way to cover what I feel is the big picture.

[quote=Joe Pietaro;2301465]It’s a sports-related media outlet. They’re into that. His claims are not going to help or hurt him in the fight. I’m only taking advantage of the build-up because of all the attention generated on the boards.

If you begin your own sports media company, then feel free to write about anything you wish. I won’t try to influence you in any way to cover what I feel is the big picture.[/quote]
Yeah, me calling you out on your BS is totally oppressing you, man.

Thanks for admitting that you’re carefully avoiding any inquiry into Darrow’s bizarre claims in order to pump up interest in what would otherwise be an obscure fight. Now go cover that “big picture” that you clipped all the large pieces out of. Restores my faith in mainstream media, it does.

[quote=Cy Q. Faunce;2301477]Yeah, me calling you out on your BS is totally oppressing you, man.

Thanks for admitting that you’re carefully avoiding any inquiry into Darrow’s bizarre claims in order to pump up interest in what would otherwise be an obscure fight. Now go cover that “big picture” that you clipped all the large pieces out of. Restores my faith in mainstream media, it does.[/quote]
But the thing is that I’m not bullshitting. I’m being blatant and very open about what makes this particular fight tick.

That doesn’t mean if Funaro was fighting someone else that I wouldn’t be covering it. It would be different because there wouldn’t be as much pre-fight fireworks but I still had intentions of bringing UG MMA (especially in my hometown) to my readers.

If you ever have the opportunity to become a part of the mainstream media, you’ll know where I’m coming from.

[quote=Joe Pietaro;2301495]But the thing is that I’m not bullshitting. I’m being blatant and very open about what makes this particular fight tick.

That doesn’t mean if Funaro was fighting someone else that I wouldn’t be covering it. It would be different because there wouldn’t be as much pre-fight fireworks but I still had intentions of bringing UG MMA (especially in my hometown) to my readers.

If you ever have the opportunity to become a part of the mainstream media, you’ll know where I’m coming from.[/quote]
Another bad assumption on your part. I’ve been “part of the mainstream media”, and the fact that it’s full of lazy people who won’t follow up a story and talented people who aren’t allowed the time to do so is a big reason I’m not in that game.

You keep shifting back and forth between saying you’re only covering the fireworks and insisting that investigating those fireworks will ruin the fun. The first is lazy and pathetic, but probably not deceptive. The second is pure buncombe.

Surely the whole back story of this, would be perfect for mainstream media? controversy, prison, ug fighting, possible fraud(undefeated fighter, the business claims?) I mean it’s this that makes the fight so interesting, if not for that, would you(Joe) be covering it?

Controversy sells, if CD was on TUF for example, I can’t see them not using the story to their advantage to make great TV. So questioning his legit-ability is another angle to spin.

Personally I could give a fuck about his finances and shit, but other bullshido members have legal knowledge/backgrounds, so it’s understandable, I know ah you have professional responsibility to keep certain things undisclosed if requested and your word as a man, but if you don’t question him and his claims, then your just presenting his words, which would be cool if say he had just scored a touchdown in super bowl final or was an athlete of stature.

I know fuck all about journalism, and the only thing I write is S&C programs.
But speaking as magazine reader, audience viewer, fightfan, etc this shit would interest me.

[quote=shaolin pimp;2301585]Surely the whole back story of this, would be perfect for mainstream media? controversy, prison, ug fighting, possible fraud(undefeated fighter, the business claims?) I mean it’s this that makes the fight so interesting, if not for that, would you(Joe) be covering it?

Controversy sells, if CD was on TUF for example, I can’t see them not using the story to their advantage to make great TV. So questioning his legit-ability is another angle to spin.[/quote]

Are you reading the thread? Isn’t that what people have been accusing Joe of? Selling the fight and not reporting or investigating? I mean I’m seriously debating culling a large portion of this to YMAS.

This is MABS it isn’t about selling a fight.

Personally I could give a fuck about his finances and shit, but other bullshido members have legal knowledge/backgrounds, so it’s understandable, I know ah you have professional responsibility to keep certain things undisclosed if requested and your word as a man, but if you don’t question him and his claims, then your just presenting his words, which would be cool if say he had just scored a touchdown in super bowl final or was an athlete of stature.

No, it wouldn’t be cool in MABS. Are some of you really this dense? Didn’t anyone notice someone started a YMAS thread to deal with pre-fight hype? Of course not. That poster, as well as others, realized all that crap doesn’t belong in this INVESTIGATIVE THREAD.

I know fuck all about journalism, and the only thing I write is S&C programs.
But speaking as magazine reader, audience viewer, fightfan, etc this shit would interest me.

Then you and Joe can go start your own website and GTFO of MABS. MABS is for investigation remember? We have a section for news.

IIF yeah people have been accusing Joe of not investigating, that is what I mean, when he said “mainstream media don’t care about being a fraud or whatever the words where” I was trying to say it makes sense to question him, for selling fight purposes, and thus actually questioning him…and therefore benefiting the investigation

I know this MABS, I agree with you, I’m trying to say that investigating him, is to the benefit of selling the fight, as well as for investigation purposes!

What I meant and the way you read it are different, I’m going back to the YMAS thread to talk shit more.

[quote=Cy Q. Faunce;2301509]Another bad assumption on your part. I’ve been “part of the mainstream media”, and the fact that it’s full of lazy people who won’t follow up a story and talented people who aren’t allowed the time to do so is a big reason I’m not in that game.

You keep shifting back and forth between saying you’re only covering the fireworks and insisting that investigating those fireworks will ruin the fun. The first is lazy and pathetic, but probably not deceptive. The second is pure buncombe.[/quote]
Having one book and a few published articles (what you previously stated as your total in the field) is not an ample amount of experience to consider yourself a part of something. Along with that, to criticize people that have paid their dues and made their bones in that industry is also something that you do not have the criteria for.

So I take it that you decided to walk away to protect your integrity, judging by what you’re saying here. But if you were doing something that you enjoyed and getting paid for it, that seems like an odd decision. I do not know and can only surmise, but I don’t think that anyone is burning up your phone line trying to convince you to come out of your self-imposed retirement.

[quote=Joe Pietaro;2301780]Having one book and a few published articles (what you previously stated as your total in the field) is not an ample amount of experience to consider yourself a part of something. Along with that, to criticize people that have paid their dues and made their bones in that industry is also something that you do not have the criteria for.

So I take it that you decided to walk away to protect your integrity, judging by what you’re saying here. But if you were doing something that you enjoyed and getting paid for it, that seems like an odd decision. I do not know and can only surmise, but I don’t think that anyone is burning up your phone line trying to convince you to come out of your self-imposed retirement.[/quote]

Are you fucking serious? You became indignant when you thought I discounted your journalism experience and then you shit on CY?

You are a fucking hypocrite.

[quote=It is Fake;2301785]Are you fucking serious? You became indignant when you thought I discounted your journalism experience and then you shit on CY?

You are a fucking hypocrite.[/quote]
I’m not shitting on him, just stating facts. He is trying to portray himself as a former member of the mainstream media when he barely had a cup of coffee in it and did not state where it was.

If I sounded indignant, it was only because I can back it up. It is what it is, like it or not.

[quote=Joe Pietaro;2301788]I’m not shitting on him, just stating facts. He is trying to portray himself as a former member of the mainstream media when he barely had a cup of coffee in it and did not state where it was.

If I sounded indignant, it was only because I can back it up. It is what it is, like it or not.[/quote]

Oh wait now you are mainstream media? He didn’t portray himself as anything that was you, with your little appeal to authority earlier. When he rose to your crappy challenge you added a new requirement.

Yes, that makes you a hypocrite.

You asked a question, it was answered, you are now goosestepping your way into YMAS subforum.

Then you can continue to tell him how mainstream you are to your hearts content.

[quote=It is Fake;2301798]Oh wait now you are mainstream media? He didn’t portray himself as anything that was you, with your little appeal to authority earlier. When he rose to your crappy challenge you added a new requirement.

Yes, that makes you a hypocrite.

You asked a question, it was answered, you are now goosestepping your way into YMAS subforum.

Then you can continue to tell him how mainstream you are to your hearts content.[/quote]

Yes, I most certainly am part of the mainstream media. Tell me why you dispute that?

And he did write that he was also a part of that group, so you either missed something in these posts or should back off defending him, because you’re not doing him any favors.

I don’t have any challenge or requirement for anyone but will defend myself when someone questions where I’m coming from.

If you are mainstream he is mainstream. Figure that out yourself.

And he did write that he was also a part of that group, so you either missed something in these posts or should back off defending him, because you’re not doing him any favors.
No, I read your stupid ass post that started this derail.

Favors?

Here’s one:

You know, I gave you kudos for your stuff that you linked to in your other post, but not for nothing - what qualifications do you have to say what someone should or shouldn’t do as far as their work is concerned? Are you a paid and professional writer? If so, have you covered anything else besides MMA?

Your request was answered.

You hoped the answer would have been none. Now, when backed into a corner, because he has articles and is published we get this drivel:

Having one book and a few published articles (what you previously stated as your total in the field) is not an ample amount of experience to consider yourself a part of something. Along with that, to criticize people that have paid their dues and made their bones in that industry is also something that you do not have the criteria for.

So I take it that you decided to walk away to protect your integrity, judging by what you’re saying here. But if you were doing something that you enjoyed and getting paid for it, that seems like an odd decision. I do not know and can only surmise, but I don’t think that anyone is burning up your phone line trying to convince you to come out of your self-imposed retirement.

Please.

I don’t have any challenge or requirement for anyone but will defend myself when someone questions where I’m coming from.

See above. When it was addressed, you started adding more requirements to make yourself feel better.