[QUOTE=ChenPengFi;2904031]Oh yay, another idiot.[/QUOTE]
Oh yay, an ad hominem attack. Wonderful rebuttal!
[QUOTE=Morik;2904032]Oh yay, an ad hominem attack. Wonderful rebuttal![/QUOTE]
That’s not an ad hominem, idiot.
It’s a conclusion.
It’s called reasoning you dumbass.
You’re an idiot because of the argument you made.
An ad hominem would be of the form “He’s an idiot, therefore his argument is invalid.”
My argument in full would read: “His argument is invalid/specious, therefore he is an idiot.” ergo no ad hominem occurred.
It bears noting in the ad hominem above, it’s still probably true, assuming the premise is.
[QUOTE=ChenPengFi;2904040]No, you’re giving medical advice to a stranger who is having complications with a prescription medication.
You are the asshole.
You’re also an idiot.
The shittiness of your post is implied by “Oh yay…” so spelling it out isn’t required.
This is not the place for your remedial English lessons.
Just to humor myself though, you cannot reliably dose an herb, period.
This is especially true with something like weed.
The rest of your post is equally shitty to be fair.
You might consider that saying you’ve been on weed for a year isn’t a great way to bolster your argument.[/QUOTE]
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Isn’t everyone in this thread giving medical advice to a stranger who is having complications with a prescription medication?
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The alleged shittiness of my post is not implied by “Oh yay…”. If you believe that it is, I suggest looking at those remedial lessons yourself.
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You can reliably dose marijuana in some limited forms:
- Edible with lab-tested measure of each cannabinoid.
- dose-regulated vaporizor with a lab-tested & known quantity of cannabinoids in the cartridge; you can get a reasonably accurate dose per hit
Further, inhalalation, while you may not know the precise # of mg of each cannabinoid you get, kicks in fast enough that you can generally self-regulate the dose to a comfortable level.
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You might consider that repeatedly calling someone an idiot instead of actually debating the points they are making isn’t a great way to bolster your argument.
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“You use marijuana regularly, thus your arguments are less valid” is another ad-hominem attack. (I was going to leave it at that, but since you are being deliberately provocative as far as I can tell, why not: you may want to invest in some remedial classes on logic, reasoning, and debate.)
[QUOTE=Morik;2904046]1) Isn’t everyone in this thread giving medical advice to a stranger who is having complications with a prescription medication?[/quote]
No.
- The alleged shittiness of my post is not implied by “Oh yay…”. If you believe that it is, I suggest looking at those remedial lessons yourself.
I wrote it so I know what I implied you dumbfuck.
- You can reliably dose marijuana in some limited forms:
- Edible with lab-tested measure of each cannabinoid.
- dose-regulated vaporizor with a lab-tested & known quantity of cannabinoids in the cartridge; you can get a reasonably accurate dose per hit
Bullshit, there’s also no body of evidence or established protocols with regards to dosing so that matter is moot anyhow; ie point #2 of your idiocy, there are no relevant accepted uses or protocols do draw from.
Further, inhalalation, while you may not know the precise # of mg of each cannabinoid you get, kicks in fast enough that you can generally self-regulate the dose to a comfortable level.
Ie reliable dosing is impossible.
Heroin kicks in fast too.
So do meth and coke.
Are you suggesting that factor negates dosing problems?
See, you are an idiot.
- You might consider that repeatedly calling someone an idiot instead of actually debating the points they are making isn’t a great way to bolster your argument.
I already told you it’s the conclusion.
Please try to keep up.
- “You use marijuana regularly, thus your arguments are less valid” is another ad-hominem attack. (I was going to leave it at that, but since you are being deliberately provocative as far as I can tell, why not: you may want to invest in some remedial classes on logic, reasoning, and debate.)
That’s a strawman, I never said that.
[QUOTE=ChenPengFi;2904050]No.[/quote]
No, you’re giving medical advice to a stranger who is having complications with a prescription medication.
You are the asshole.
You’re also an idiot.
Let me rephrase. Is everyone on this thread who has in any way given medical advice to the OP an asshole?
Or just me? (If just me, then your initial phrase is too broad–say what you actually mean.)
I wrote it so I know what I implied you dumbfuck.
Uh huh. So if I say “dude…” and then claim that I implied you were a green-colored flea-sized alien, that is ok?
I.e., any person making any statement may claim that it implies whatever they like, and anyone who didn’t pick up on their supposed implication is slow?
BTW You seem kinda angry. (I’m inferring from all the name-calling, which as far as I can tell is serving no purpose but to possibly make you feel better.)
You may want to look into therapy or something.
Bullshit, there’s also no body of evidence or established protocols with regards to dosing so that matter is moot anyhow; ie point #2 of your idiocy, there are no relevant accepted uses or protocols do draw from.
I never claimed there was an established dosing protocol for herbal marijuana.
I claimed that it is possible to get reasonably accurate doses in several forms. Do you disagree with that? If so, in what way is your dose inaccurate if you are eating a lab-tested edible with a known # of mgs of each cannabinoid?
However, I think this whole branch of the conversation is somewhat irrelevant. You don’t need highly accurate doses to get high, have it relax you, have it make you sleepier.
Ie reliable dosing is impossible.
No, read the lines just above the one you made this response to.
Heroin kicks in fast too.
So do meth and coke.
Are you suggesting that factor negates dosing problems?
Heroin, Meth, and Coke all have lethal doses not that much larger than typical usage. (I base this statement on my minor knowledge of pharmacology.)
Marijuana does not have a known lethal dose. Failing to dose marijuana correctly has much less catastrophic effects (if you get “too much” you may have some mental discomfort for a time, but the chemical isn’t going to kill you.)
So yes, for marijuana this factor mostly negates the dosing problems.
See, you are an idiot.
I fail to see how your alleged claims regarding whether I’m an idiot or not are relevant to this conversation–what is your purpose for including such statements in each of your responses?
Are you attempting to bully me out of continuing to converse with you? Are you thinking that it somehow adds to your points/arguments?
I already told you it’s the conclusion.
Please try to keep up.
I have made many conclusions about you which I haven’t put in this post. Why? Because they aren’t relevant to the conversation.
What causes you to believe that my alleged idiocy is relevant to this conversation? Are you trying to convince others I am an idiot so they will disregard my posts?
Isn’t that essentially an ad-hominem attack? (“Don’t listen to this guy, he’s an idiot.”)
What does it add to your arguments?
That’s a strawman, I never said that.
To quote you, “Its called reasoning, dumbass”.
You said:
You might consider that saying you’ve been on weed for a year isn’t a great way to bolster your argument.
The implication of this statement is that the arguments of someone who uses marijuana regularly are less valid.
Unlike your repeated “conclusions” that I’m an idiot, me sharing that I’ve been using marijuana regularly for a year is relevant to this conversation since some of what I said was based on my personal experiences.’
EDIT: And to back up a bit, the only actual “medical advice” I posted was this:
If you want to give it a shot and are not looking to gain weight, I’d recommend eating prior to dosing and just making a rule that you don’t really eat while high.
I.e., “If you decide to try X, here is something I have found helpful for me using X.”
And this:
You don’t have to smoke it (lung damage and all that). You can vaporize flower or concentrates and get as big or small a dose as you like with generally very little material actually entering your lungs (and what does enter is not combustion by-products/smoke/etc). (Especially with concentrates.)
I did not claim to be a doctor. I did not suggest that he should use marijuana over whatever else. I replied to the concern someone brought up about weight gain and marijuana with some information from studies, and I made two recommendations about how to deal with potential issues with using marijuana based on my personal experience.
This seems to have greatly upset you for some reason.
Further, the only argument you have made as to why my initial post is specious is that “you can’t dose an herb properly”.
I agree that there are no official standards for dosing marijuana. From personal experience and from my general knowledge that I’ve picked up over the years, I can tell you that you can use marijuana and regulate roughly how high you get, without such standards in place.
So… you were expecting reasonable readers to infer “Your post is shitty because of your specious implication that you have any control over dosing, and thus you are an idiot” from “oh yay, another idiot”?
[QUOTE=Morik;2904052]Let me rephrase. Is everyone on this thread who has in any way given medical advice to the OP an asshole?
Or just me? (If just me, then your initial phrase is too broad–say what you actually mean.)[/quote]
No, and no it’s not.
Uh huh. So if I say “dude…” and then claim that I implied you were a green-colored flea-sized alien, that is ok?
I.e., any person making any statement may claim that it implies whatever they like, and anyone who didn’t pick up on their supposed implication is slow?
BTW You seem kinda angry. (I’m inferring from all the name-calling, which as far as I can tell is serving no purpose but to possibly make you feel better.)
You may want to look into therapy or something.
This is you being a dumbass and making more logical fallacies.
I never claimed there was an established dosing protocol for herbal marijuana.
I know, I claimed there isn’t one, dummy.
It invalidates any notion of a “proper dose” however.
I claimed that it is possible to get reasonably accurate doses in several forms. Do you disagree with that? If so, in what way is your dose inaccurate if you are eating a lab-tested edible with a known # of mgs of each cannabinoid?
No, I don’t agree and it’s a red herring anyway.
Dosing is irrelevant.
[quoet]However, I think this whole branch of the conversation is somewhat irrelevant. You don’t need highly accurate doses to get high, have it relax you, have it make you sleepier.[/quote]
No, the OP is having an adverse drug reaction.
You’re suggesting getting high.
Adding another drug to that mix only complicates things.
Furthermore you have no idea what the combination will do.
Heroin, Meth, and Coke all have lethal doses not that much larger than typical usage. (I base this statement on my minor knowledge of pharmacology.)
Marijuana does not have a known lethal dose. Failing to dose marijuana correctly has much less catastrophic effects (if you get “too much” you may have some mental discomfort for a time, but the chemical isn’t going to kill you.)
So yes, for marijuana this factor mostly negates the dosing problems.
No, it still invalidates your premise.
You are too dumb to understand why, too.
I fail to see how your alleged claims regarding whether I’m an idiot or not are relevant to this conversation–what is your purpose for including such statements in each of your responses?
My entertainment, a sense of ethics and shining a light on the obvious are my sole motivations.
Are you attempting to bully me out of continuing to converse with you? Are you thinking that it somehow adds to your points/arguments?
…and the butthurt begins…
I have made many conclusions about you which I haven’t put in this post. Why? Because they aren’t relevant to the conversation.
What causes you to believe that my alleged idiocy is relevant to this conversation? Are you trying to convince others I am an idiot so they will disregard my posts?
Isn’t that essentially an ad-hominem attack? (“Don’t listen to this guy, he’s an idiot.”)
What does it add to your arguments?
Asked and answered whiner.
To quote you, “Its called reasoning, dumbass”.
You said:
The implication of this statement is that the arguments of someone who uses marijuana regularly are less valid.
No dipshit.
You can’t read.
"… isn’t a great way to bolster your argument. " /= “You use marijuana regularly, thus your arguments are less valid”
In other words not adding to it isn’t the same as invalidating it.
You are dumb.
Unlike your repeated “conclusions” that I’m an idiot, me sharing that I’ve been using marijuana regularly for a year is relevant to this conversation since some of what I said was based on my personal experiences.’
Yes, I know you’re high.
Your anecdotes mean nothing.
This seems to have greatly upset you for some reason.
Hahahahaha…
Further, the only argument you have made as to why my initial post is specious is that “you can’t dose an herb properly”.
I agree that there are no official standards for dosing marijuana. From personal experience and from my general knowledge that I’ve picked up over the years, I can tell you that you can use marijuana and regulate roughly how high you get, without such standards in place.
You’re an idiot.
You cannot properly dose something that doesn’t have a proper dose.
So… you were expecting reasonable readers to infer “Your post is shitty because of your specious implication that you have any control over dosing, and thus you are an idiot” from “oh yay, another idiot”?
No your posts are shitty because you’re a dumbass.
I’m not too concerned about the readers because I knew I could count on your to help spell it out for them.
So if not everyone giving medical advice is an asshole, then your argument/statement:
“You are giving medical advice to a stranger… You are the asshole” is insufficient given that the first statement doesn’t imply that I’m an asshole.
I think what you actually mean is “You are giving medical advice that I disagree with to a stranger, and thus you are an asshole.”
Let me summarize my view of the conversation so far. Perhaps you will have fun “correcting” it while interspersing various irrelevant (to the validity of my content, at least) commentary on my mental acuity.
- OP has issue with current sleep medication, is causing weight gain.
- Someone else mentioned that they know people who swear by Marijuana for sleep.
- Your response to this person was “stfu” (at this point I inferred that you have an issue of some sort with Marijuana use).
- Someone mentioned possibility of weight gain with marijuana.
- I reply that studies have shown that regular marijuana users are actually less obese on average than non-regular marijuana users, and made some statements based on my experience.
- You respond “oh yay, another idiot”, apparently attempting to imply that my entire post is shitty/specious, and apparently the basis of this implication is that you disagree with my claim that you can control anything about the dose of marijuana?
- We spin off into a semantic debate about various bullshit, as well as a few other things.
You cannot properly dose something that doesn’t have a proper dose.
You are wrong.
Someone taking one puff of marijuana is getting a massively different dose than someone who smokes an entire joint.
Therefore, it is possible to have at least some control over the dose you are taking.
Given that the feedback you get as you take small incremental exposure to it is relatively fast, you can use this as a feedback loop into whether to dose further or not.
I’m not claiming it is precise. I am claiming that it is ok that it isn’t precise.
No dipshit.
You can’t read.
"… isn’t a great way to bolster your argument. " /= “You use marijuana regularly, thus your arguments are less valid”
In other words not adding to it isn’t the same as invalidating it.
You are dumb.
But “oh yay” == “Your post is specious”? 
No, the OP is having an adverse drug reaction.
You’re suggesting getting high.
Adding another drug to that mix only complicates things.
Furthermore you have no idea what the combination will do.
If you read carefully, you will notice that I did not in fact ever suggest that the OP get high. If I am mistaken, please quote the post where I suggested this.
Would you react similarly if someone said he should try a cup of chamomile tea before bed? (Note that this is more than what I did, which was comment on “If you try marijuana, consider doing X”.)
You can’t dose that accurately either, and you don’t know how it may interact.
Further, who says he would still be taking the drug that he is having problems with?
Most of your other responses are irrelevant insults and I will not bother responding to them. (And I see that you are still resorting to ad hominem attacks: “Your posts are shitty because you are a dumbass” is neither a well-reasoned nor convincing argument. You seem a bit thick on this front, so let me spell it out further for you: If this were a valid argument, anyone could win any argument with “your argument is shitty because you are a dumbass”.)
Also I hope your tongue grows fur. Good day sir.
[QUOTE=Morik;2904068]So if not everyone giving medical advice is an asshole, then your argument/statement:
“You are giving medical advice to a stranger… You are the asshole” is insufficient given that the first statement doesn’t imply that I’m an asshole.
I think what you actually mean is “You are giving medical advice that I disagree with to a stranger, and thus you are an asshole.”[/quote]
You are an asshole above and beyond that transgression and the latter is not dependent on the former.
You think wrong, but we know that already.
Let me summarize my view of the conversation so far. Perhaps you will have fun “correcting” it while interspersing various irrelevant (to the validity of my content, at least) commentary on my mental acuity.
- OP has issue with current sleep medication, is causing weight gain.
- Someone else mentioned that they know people who swear by Marijuana for sleep.
- Your response to this person was “stfu” (at this point I inferred that you have an issue of some sort with Marijuana use).
No, I’d have said more or less the same thing if it was ginseng you imbecile.
- Someone mentioned possibility of weight gain with marijuana.
- I reply that studies have shown that regular marijuana users are actually less obese on average than non-regular marijuana users, and made some statements based on my experience.
- You respond “oh yay, another idiot”, apparently attempting to imply that my entire post is shitty/specious, and apparently the basis of this implication is that you disagree with my claim that you can control anything about the dose of marijuana?
- We spin off into a semantic debate about various bullshit, as well as a few other things.
The shittiness of your posts is self evident.
You are being corrected and are trying to paint it as something subjective.
On the other hand you think your subjective, anecdotal experiences are relevant.
That’s absurd.
You are wrong.
Someone taking one puff of marijuana is getting a massively different dose than someone who smokes an entire joint.
Therefore, it is possible to have at least some control over the dose you are taking.
This is more of your FAS/pothead reasoning.
You’re moving goalposts now (all while missing the greater context)…
Given that the feedback you get as you take small incremental exposure to it is relatively fast, you can use this as a feedback loop into whether to dose further or not.
That’s more bullshit.
I think that covers the rest of your silly crying as well.
You are an asshole above and beyond that transgression and the latter is not dependent on the former.
You think wrong, but we know that already.
That transgression referring to the disagreed-upon medical advice, what above and beyond have I done to earn myself the extra asshole-ishness?
As far as I can tell, I’m being relatively more civil in my discourse than you are, and am actually trying to have a conversation, while you continue to deflect and throw names around.
If I am thinking wrong, please correct me. I like to learn.
However, saying “its obvious dumbass” doesn’t count as a correction.
The shittiness of your posts is self evident.
You are being corrected and are trying to paint it as something subjective.
On the other hand you think your subjective, anecdotal experiences are relevant.
That’s absurd.
blah blah bullshit statements blah blah. Those aren’t arguments, except that last part.
I find that last point interesting though. Why is my subjective anecdotal experience irrelevant?
This is more of your FAS/pothead reasoning.
You’re moving goalposts now (all while missing the greater context)…
I can only assume by FAS you mean fetal alcohol syndrome? Witty
In what way is my reasoning flawed? (Hopefully in a less obvious way than “The shittiness of your posts is self-evident”, but who knows maybe you can teach me something.)
You claimed, essentially, that there is no way at to control dosing of an herb.
Do you dispute that someone taking one puff off a joint, and someone else smoking the entire joint, are getting different doses?
Or perhaps you feel that the different doses are irrelevant without a point of reference to anchor them to? (That may be a fair point, and perhaps I shouldn’t be making it for you, but you seem to be having trouble making actual points in your posts.)
I can tell you from personal experience as well as reading a lot of other peoples’ experiences, that a user of marijuana has a good amount of control over the intensity of subjective effects they experience, and the means of that control is in how much you use. That sure sounds like controlling dosage to me.
[quote]Given that the feedback you get as you take small incremental exposure to it is relatively fast, you can use this as a feedback loop into whether to dose further or not.
That’s more bullshit.[/quote]
That’s not an argument. I am actually interested in why you think that is bullshit.
So when did this “Weed is the panacea of a new age!” thing become so mainstream?
if that is directed at me, I would like to point out that there are several pretty well documented effects of marijuana:
- Appetite stimulation
- Sleepiness
Saying marijuana could make you sleepy is not quite calling it a panacea.
If you were directing that out to the world in general, then I do not have issue with your question. I think its touted as being good for a lot of things that it just acts as a placebo for (in my opinion).
[QUOTE=goodlun;2904145]It is indeed NOT an ad hominem. This is a common mistake.
An insult isn’t one, for a logical fallacy to be able to apply there has to be an argument made. Chen did not put forward an argument he just declared you an idiot, something he was apparently very right about.
An ad Hominem would don’t listen to him he rapes children. Not holy shit your logic is horrible you must be an idiot.[/QUOTE]
Sure, if someone walks up to me and says “hey idiot” that isn’t an ad hominem attack.
He didn’t say holy shit your logic is terrible.
He said “oh yay, another idiot”.
If someone says “we should raise taxes on the wealthy” in a public forum and someone publically responds “oh yay, an idiot,” that response is attacking the person making the statement, rather than attacking the statement.
[QUOTE=Morik;2904155]
If someone says “we should raise taxes on the wealthy” in a public forum and someone publically responds “oh yay, an idiot,” that response is attacking the person making the statement, rather than attacking the statement.[/QUOTE]
You are still wrong because his response isn’t an argument it’s a statement. For something to be a logical fallacy there has to be an attached argument.
Calling you an idiot isn’t an argument.
You are still a fucking idiot.
For something to be a logical fallacy there has to be an attached argument.
The argument is implied by the context in which his statement was made.
[QUOTE=Morik;2904159]The argument is implied by the context in which his statement was made.[/QUOTE]
There was no implicit argument there. It’s all in your head.
[QUOTE=Morik;2904159]The argument is implied by the context in which his statement was made.[/QUOTE]
Wrong again dumbass.
Your logic is atrocious.
You have it backwards.
The funniest part is a pothead accusing other people of adding irrelevant material, when he’s talking about pot consumption on a health concern thread by someone uninterested in pot.
Suggesting that pot consumption might be ok, or worse beneficial, is unethical and ignorant in this instance.
When someone is trying to deal with complications arising from medication the last thing you want to do is add a confound.
This is especially true with something as poorly understood as pot.
But, you’re dumb and self absorbed.
So you did just that.
And now you’re taking the corrections personally.
We’ve seen it all before if that’s any consolation.
You went right by the playbook in fact.
jesus what has this spiralled into?
[QUOTE=kimjonghng;2904293]jesus what has this spiralled into?[/QUOTE]
My apologies OP, I got a bit carried away bickering with Chen for my own amusement.
I’ll stop bickering with him in this thread.
Some actual suggestions/ideas for you:
Have you tried various physical relaxation techniques? E.g., lying on your back in bed, focus on individual muscle areas, clenching really tight for a few seconds, then relaxing it, and slowly moving along your body until you’ve hit most of it? I find this can help me relax especially if I’m physically uncomfortable for some reason. E.g., sore muscles, mild injuries, etc.
A few other things I’ve heard anecdotally but haven’t tried or done any real research into:
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If your mind keeps spinning on things you need to do tomorrow, or thoughts about anything really, you can keep a pad of paper & pencil by your bed and just write the thoughts down. This supposedly can be helpful in resolving the issues you are thinking about for the moment such that you won’t keep circling back them in your mind.
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Consider what activities you are doing for the ~2 hours before bed. If you are using a computer or other screen, you may get more wired/hard to fall asleep for a while afterwards. IIRC, shifting their emitted light spectrum away from blue may help (again, I haven’t actually researched this, just heard about it). E.g., using a computer program such as https://justgetflux.com/ (which I just found with a quick google search on “blue light computer program”).
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Mental relaxation techniques such as meditation may also help, especially if you do them routinely so it signals to your body that you are about to try to sleep. E.g., meditate for 20/30/60 minutes every night at the same time, say right before or right after you prepare for bed.
Again, it’s not an ad hominem you retard.
You’re still making suggestions.
Your posts remind me of this puzzle,
except instead of squares it’s logical fallacies that are everywhere and intertwined.
It also bears noting, the ad hominem of “He’s a dumbass, therefore his argument is invalid.” that even though I never made this argument, it is probably true.
So cry me a river moron.