Break off a piece for me

Reviews, Videos, and Everything Else Trollshido
1

I really couldnt say its more or less dangerous than a guillotine choke, but attacking the trachea region is very risky business, you add a man squirming violently to try and escape and it could be a recipe for disaster.

Its fairly common in typical two hand choking attacks ( the good ole fashion attack with both hands from the front) to actually break off parts of the thyroid cartlidge and surrounding cartlidge of the trachea.

I think chokes in general , while obviously efficient and effective means of making aggressive people play nice, should be strongly thought out when considering applying to someone in the case of a streetfight or self defence.

If im not mistaken an attack to a persons throat is immediate assualt with intent to do serious bodily harm, opening the doors wide open to legal issues as well as given the other guy the right to more or less end your day.

2

Excised from: How were you taught hadaka-jime/RNC : blood/air choke? - No BS MMA and Martial Arts

dig7six, you do not know enough about chokes to speak about them in an informed manner.

3

[quote=The Grinch;2286045]Excised from: How were you taught hadaka-jime/RNC : blood/air choke? - No BS MMA and Martial Arts

dig7six, you do not know enough about chokes to speak about them in an informed manner.[/quote]

How do you know what i know and what i dont know about chokes or anatomy for that matter ? Personally you moving my post doesnt bother me in the slightiest. I suggest you look into anatomy and then the law, there is plenty of forensic evidence to support damage to the trachea caused by choking.

And the fact of putting your hands around a persons throat in a fight being ground for the use of deadly force comes from my attorney.

To assume i dont know enough about choking techniques because Bjj/judo isnt my main style makes about as much sense as assuming a man who doesnt study boxing cant knock someone unconscious.

Ive been studying/applying/being choked since i was about 14 years old,…im 33 now, so id say i prolly know more about choking and being choked than you.

Anyway,…on deaf ears im sure.

4

How do you know what i know and what i dont know about chokes or anatomy for that matter ? Personally you moving my post doesnt bother me in the slightiest. I suggest you look into anatomy and then the law, there is plenty of forensic evidence to support damage to the trachea caused by choking.

And the fact of putting your hands around a persons throat in a fight being ground for the use of deadly force comes from my attorney.

To assume i dont know enough about choking techniques because Bjj/judo isnt my main style makes about as much sense as assuming a man who doesnt study boxing cant knock someone unconscious.

Ive been studying/applying/being choked since i was about 14 years old,…im 33 now, so id say i prolly know more about choking and being choked than you.

Anyway,…on deaf ears im sure.

5

easy, he read what you wrote.

6

I really wish one of you post monkeys would actually give a valid reason for the shit you say. Show me where im wrong ?

7

Okay.

[quote=dig7six;2286009]Its fairly common in typical two hand choking attacks ( the good ole fashion attack with both hands from the front) to actually break off parts of the thyroid cartlidge and surrounding cartlidge of the trachea.

I think chokes in general , while obviously efficient and effective means of making aggressive people play nice, should be strongly thought out when considering applying to someone in the case of a streetfight or self defence.

If im not mistaken an attack to a persons throat is immediate assualt with intent to do serious bodily harm, opening the doors wide open to legal issues as well as given the other guy the right to more or less end your day.[/quote]
The part above is all wrong. Regarding the first paragraph, please provide evidence that there is a statistical trend of throat cartilage “breaking off in pieces” when people are rape choked. Cartilage is a connective tissue. It tends to stretch or tear when traumatized, rather than pieces breaking off.

Second and third paragraph, I have personally used the RNC choke to restrain hostile people, including up to the point where I released said person over to the police on more than one occasion. I was neither arrested, nor harassed for using excessive force.

There is a difference between sitting on top of someone in the mount and trying to crush their trachea versus restraining an out of control person with a RNC.

If you had significant experience with chokes other than the rape choke, you would know this.

8

[quote=dig7six;2286009]I really couldnt say its more or less dangerous than a guillotine choke, but attacking the trachea region is very risky business, you add a man squirming violently to try and escape and it could be a recipe for disaster.

Its fairly common in typical two hand choking attacks ( the good ole fashion attack with both hands from the front) to actually break off parts of the thyroid cartlidge and surrounding cartlidge of the trachea.

I think chokes in general , while obviously efficient and effective means of making aggressive people play nice, should be strongly thought out when considering applying to someone in the case of a streetfight or self defence.

If im not mistaken an attack to a persons throat is immediate assualt with intent to do serious bodily harm, opening the doors wide open to legal issues as well as given the other guy the right to more or less end your day.[/quote]

I don’t know all that much about chokes, but are you familiar with blood chokes? Dosen’t involve anyone’s trachea, attacking any throats, or smashing any hyoid bones and still results in loss of consciousness. If you’re afraid of legal reprocussions for “attacking someone’s throat” go this route. Problem solved!

“Ive been studying/applying/being choked since i was about 14 years old,…im 33 now, so id say i prolly know more about choking and being choked than you.”

Are you familiar with INXS?

9

Actually the rear naked choke is taught in federal and state law enforcement academies as a good way of restraining someone without causing severe bodily harm. It is not seen as deadly force in the use of force guidelines in most states.

And there are some places that teach ways of crushing the trachea, which is VERY hard to do. It is also taught as a useless technique because of it is not very effective but very compromising if you try and don’t succeed.

You also bring up an issue of Attacking a person’s throat on the street, and how it could be judged as assault with intent to do serious bodily harm. This shows that you are not that familiar with the topic because what you are describing is battery not assault.

Besides the fact that most will agree that these techniques should be used as a defense and not offense. In which case you should be looking to justify your actions of defense and should respond appropriately to the level of force used against you.

I think that the combination of all of these things in your post that were not completely accurate takes away from to credibility to some degree and that is why your post was moved here. Just because you have been choking people since you were 14 doesn’t mean you were doing it correctly or are an expert in how to do it properly.

10

[quote=The Grinch;2286497]Okay.

The part above is all wrong. Regarding the first paragraph, please provide evidence that there is a statistical trend of throat cartilage “breaking off in pieces” when people are rape choked. Cartilage is a connective tissue. It tends to stretch or tear when traumatized, rather than pieces breaking off.

Second and third paragraph, I have personally used the RNC choke to restrain hostile people, including up to the point where I released said person over to the police on more than one occasion. I was neither arrested, nor harassed for using excessive force.

There is a difference between sitting on top of someone in the mount and trying to crush their trachea versus restraining an out of control person with a RNC.

If you had significant experience with chokes other than the rape choke, you would know this.[/quote]

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/171780.php

^ ill dig up more from a forensic prespective.

It makes no difference if your sitting in the mount using two hands and as you said “rape choking”, if its your thumbs or your forearm makes no differense and obviously more damage could be done with the forearm.

Im glad you had positive results with being able to restrain some guy who was being a jackass to you. I dont doubt at all that you holding a guy who is going buck wild looks far better than you beating his face into a swollen lump to the police as they show up.

My point is/was that is while you were restraining that man, IF he felt he was unable to breath, leagally he could use any means neccessary to inspire you to let go, and all it would have to say is " i couldnt breath, i was afraid i was going to die and i couldnt get him to let go any other way"

A jury and judge will look at choking someone way differently than an officer in the field im sure. Worth mentioning is many police stations are doing away with officers being able to use chokes…to many frigging problems and law suits.

To add fuel to the fire, carotid/blood chokes can do major damage in the right individual as well, damage that may not surface for years.

Im not claiming to be an authority on law or anatomy, but what i have stated is true.

11

Dig76 is right on some accounts. The fact of the matter is the INTENT of the choke which he is not understanding nor explaining himself correctly.

In the act of self defense a properly applied RNC to the carotids will pass in front of a judge and jury IF properly explained to them by a good attorney. Keeping in mind that you have to be using it to protect yourself from a violent attack. Just remember as I always said self defense will save you from criminal charges but the civil suit that may follow is entirely different. Reasonable force is always the issue and depending in the judge or state the rules may be different.

Police use to use a choke hold with their baton for assistance and that one actually killed people on several occasions. I remember the story when I was going through some courses as a cop. Since then most departments removed chokes from SOP to save legal issues.

12

[quote=dig7six;2286518]http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/171780.php

^ ill dig up more from a forensic prespective.

[/quote]

Maybe I missed something but that link says nothing about cartilage breaking off into pieces when being choked. Once again, where is your evidence you understand the choke addressed?

13

Its fairly common in typical two hand choking attacks ( the good ole fashion attack with both hands from the front) to actually break off parts of the thyroid cartlidge and surrounding cartlidge of the trachea.

This is the issue right here. Can it happen? Yes. Fairly common? Not in the way you described.

14

“If the damage is particularly severe, a piece of cartilage can break off and become loose.”

15

How common it is i am of course not to sure about, but it CAN, DOES and COULD happen.

16

[quote=Coach Josh;2286528]
Police use to use a choke hold with their baton for assistance and that one actually killed people on several occasions. .[/quote]

The leverage and strength of the baton makes the choke dangerous not the choke itself, come on you know that.

17

All in all folks, im really not into the idea od debating, i was just pointing out the obvious perhaps. One of the things i like about an open forum is the ability to bounce ideas of other people as well as see different and more opinions.

I think when talking about chokes in some cases anyway, the dangers and legal ramifications should be made mention. Jujutsu or its many names is IMO a very serious martial art, the tactics and methods of strangulations, chokes , breaks and dislocations is without a doubt one of if not the most destructive methods devised.

Sadly im not to sure others who even train in these arts respect its history and original purpose. My post was a generalization of a large and at best grey subject (legal wise) and was not put up with the intent to lead or give any advice on the bigger picture, but to simply point out there are other things to consider when using these tactics.

18

I’m curious is English your second language? You are absolutely and completely missing every point that has been raised.

19

David read the whole paragraph

20

I actually think i have anwsered every point that has been raised concerning my post, as well as gave a link to medically verify where i was coming from. Which is ironic , because i have asked for those who have said i was wrong to show me other wise, and the only one who has produced a link is me.