With a proper training programme and good beginner management you can minimise spazzing. Spazzing mainly becomes a problem when beginners are just inserted into a normal class and there is no introductory programme for beginners where they are all brought on together.
I’m a huge heavy guy, and often I have the advantage (as some of the other guys here have said) of being able to fold a beginner up without necessarily causing too much pain, or wrenching submissions on too quickly, etc. This has been mainly due to my size, and somewhat less to do with previous grappling experience.
When I’m rolling with my betters (by far the larger sample in this equation) I already know that I don’t learn anything by simply crushing someone with my weight. This fact in addition to the (the guys at my gym are better than me so they can stay on top easier) fact actually leads to me spending the majority of my time on my back, which probably means I spend more time training defensively than offensively (which actually works out pretty well for my level of development).
The white belt classes at the school where I train were just changed because of noob spazzing. The black belt who runs my school was getting emails from people who were quitting because they were getting crushed in free rolling and so ended up not wanting to train jiu jitsu. It wasn’t a ton of people, but it was enough that he decided that for the white belt classes they would do positional wrestling only until they had 3 stripes on their white belt, at which point they could jump into the blue belt and up classes. I think this is a pretty good compromise - the noobs have a clearly defined goal such as escaping side control or the back or whatever, and they still get to go “live”. I know the argument on the other side is that people pay for jiu jitsu because they want to wrestle, they want to have fun and test themselves, and I get it, but if people are leaving the school because people can’t be cool about it then I understand the decision. A lot of Gracie schools are super strict about not letting white belts free roll until they get a LOT of experience because of this stuff. I remember when I was starting out, I had no clue what the heck I was doing and probably wouldn’t have minded having the structure of simple positional wrestling for the first six months or whatever. As an experienced blue, at this point I don’t care if the people I roll with are flipping out or not, as I will either let them exhaust themselves and capitalize on their mistakes or just tap if they’re sitting on my neck or whatever. But I think it matters more for people who are just getting started.
I’m a BJJ white, fresh from two years of judo. Imagine how I feel. I know enough to think technically and go relaxed, but still, my ground game is difficult when some 100kg (Metric, learn it fuckers) asshole is trying to choke me from my guard. I can survive, and win, but it’s not fucking comfortable.
I just chill out. I usually roll back into guard. I hate other no stripe white belts because they just try and give me gi rash.
[QUOTE=judoka_uk;2533409]With a proper training programme and good beginner management you can minimise spazzing. Spazzing mainly becomes a problem when beginners are just inserted into a normal class and there is no introductory programme for beginners where they are all brought on together.[/QUOTE]
This is my point. Without a higher ranking belt instructing them, how would a new student know to relax and focus on technique? I think the noob mentality is that bjj/judo/etc. are competitive sports, and the objective of rolling is to win. It’s like a pickup game of hoops - sure it’s fun, but you still play to win.
I wish every white belt in the world would read and take WhiteSharks post to heart, though.
Yes - spazzing is using sheer strength to grapple, while throwing technique out the window.
If you’re grunting and straining, you’re spazzing 9/10 times.
Here’s a video example - watch the dude in the red belt - he’s trying to overcome technique with pure athleticism. Notice that he’s yanking, jerking, pulling, and essentially making things worse for himself every step of the way. He thinks he’s grappling… that’s a spaz.
[QUOTE=PDA;2533628]Can somebody define “Spazzing” please.
May sound silly my asking but ive only trained in one place and everybody trys to kill each other when we roll.
Is this spazzing?
The teacher often shouts at people for trying to use strength rather than tecnique and people rarely get injured.[/QUOTE]
If you have no idea what you are doing, but you are doing it as hard and fast as you can, then you’re spazzing.
If you know what you’re doing, then you’re not spazzing, generally speaking. You can still be rolling with too much intensity for the circumstances without it being considered spazzing.
A lot of wrestlers don’t spazz, but go WAY to hard for drilling in class.
You forgot the word control in your sentence.
So to go as hard and fast as you can “with or under control”
Is not necessarily spazzing. You can hold back on a sub and still be spazzing.
What kintanon said.
When a whitebelt decides to go !hulksmash! on me I usually make an effort to tap him with a scarf hold. I’ve managed a few times. Fortunately my instructors are pretty good at phasing most of the noobs into sparring and supervising them/coaching them throughs it… so they usually do it but individually most of them chill out pretty fast.
[QUOTE=Ciderbone;2533929]When a whitebelt decides to go !hulksmash! on me I usually make an effort to tap him with a scarf hold.[/QUOTE]
I’ve been studying Omega’s Armbar montage:
http://www.facebook.com/video/?oid=206249487538
I want to be able to say to someone (a beginner) before rolling: “Ok, I’m only going to go for one submission, the extended arm bar.” And then proceed to tie them up in 30 different arm bars 
I didn’t spaz, I didn’t have friends that spazzed, we got better much faster, working out kinks in our games, most of us are blue now going onward, but the spazzes have left or are still flopping around like dying fish, so stupid.
Really does make you not fun/safe to roll with and you will be marked as ‘that noob spaz’.
[QUOTE=Mr.Miyagi;2539826]I didn’t spaz, I didn’t have friends that spazzed, we got better much faster, working out kinks in our games, most of us are blue now going onward, but the spazzes have left or are still flopping around like dying fish, so stupid.
Really does make you not fun/safe to roll with and you will be marked as ‘that noob spaz’.[/QUOTE]
Awesome I’m glad to see someone else near the beginning of their career sticking up for the no spazz from the start mentality.
I’m still a white belt and have been going to class for about 10 months. At the start I definitely used my muscles alot more than I should have, thats why I always found myself almost dead after the first roll.
After about 6 months I don’t no what changed but all of a sudden I really started to take note when I was using too much energy instead of stoping, thinking and then trying to apply the correct techniques. I now always make a point of thinking about when I should and should not apply energy. The best way I’ve found is to concentrate on my breathing. If I notice I’m holding my breath I know i’m probably not doing it right.
Now I’m not saying I no longer muscle out of positions, because I still do. Usually it happens when I can’t think of or don’t know the proper technique and I start feeling flustered. It’s a learning curve, as I get better at my technique hopefully I will start to muscle less and less.
It’s easy to say trust me, the plate’s hot. But sometimes people have to learn for themselves.
As a grappling newbie, I really appreciate this thread. Its good food for thought.
I remember my first couple of BJJ lessons. I gassed so hard I puked. Repeatedly. Fortunately I was already a member of this site. Now, whether it was here or on the mat, early on I received the best advice I have had so far: “breathe”. I also had the benefit of trawling through countless bullshido threads about being a noob in BJJ and they all seemed to give the same impression, slow down, breathe.
Breathing is important, I was to later understand through various avenues of research. Apparently when you breathe there is this particular element called “air” that is vital to this thing known as “life” that enters the lungs and through a series of processes called “magic”, it gives the body the ability to do voluntary “things”. Put simply: without this “air” you cannot perform the “magic” required to do “things” you want to do. Lack of air, as evidenced above, on top of having the ability of turning you into a coward, can cause involuntary “things”, such as vomiting, passing out and my personal favourite, shitting yourself.
So when I, as a noob, went back for my third BJJ lesson I began to learn about this thing called “tapping”. Because I wasn’t using my brute strength and pure awesome “I totally would’ve punched you in the face if you tried that shit on the street” attitude, I began learning that when someone is in a dominant position on top of me, struggling like I was a character in a Saw movie had a similar, though decidedly less gory, effect as being a character in a Saw movie.
So, after a while, I put two and two together and because I finished the first grade, I came up with four. Four being the numerical equivalent of maintaining a consistent breathing pattern while someone was in a dominant position. It became apparent that I didn’t gas out as quick. This gave me time to remember the various escapes taught to me in class. Lo and behold, escapes and sweeps began to occur. No, they were not regular, yes, against the more experienced players they were probably gifts, but they began happening.
Recently, while I was in mount, this guy was spazzing hard. My coach was yelling at me for various reasons, but I am heaps good now so I don’t need to listen to him anymore (note to noobs: this is never the case and was written for purely comical purposes), but I was happy to ride mount like the noob was a bull and I was in the PBR, only my chest and belly were smothering the bull as he bucked. Surprise, surprise, he gassed and I choked him out. Coach commended me on an awesome display of BJJ prowess. In reality, Coach did not commend me on my laziness, but that is what I chose to hear, once again, for comical purposes only (please, Coach, it is only a joke).
Moral of the story: I forget, listen to the other more experienced guys above.
Moral of the